Leigh-Anne Wiig examines the growth of evangelical style Christian churches and their foray into politics. (A transcript of National Radio's Insight programme from Sunday 27 March 2005, slightly edited for clarity by GayNZ.com and published here by permission of Radio New Zealand.) City Impact preacher: The moral crisis we face today is the result not of sinners running loose but rather of Christians remaining passive and prayerless. Only if we repent, recommence and re-mobilise do we have a hope for reformation. Let's pray. Brian Tamaki (Destiny Church): I'm saying this: it's no longer politically correct and politically right for the church to be politically neutral. It is moral, it is moral suicide for the church to continue and to persist that you should not be involved politically. The more the church backs off being politically voiced and active in our message, the more that liberals and the secular humanists will set up walls that will crush the future of our children and our families. Wiig: Conservative Christian churches such as Destiny church and City Impact church are rallying their congregation to take their Christian message to parliament. More than ten thousand people took to the streets of Auckland [last] month and made it clear what they were pushing for. First marcher: We're here to stand for, sort of, family values and we'll stand against the moral decline of our country, really. Second marcher: We've got to make a stand against some of these policies that are coming through Parliament that really does affect our families. It's gong all wrong, it's going down the hill. Third marcher: Traditional family values, you know, we're standing up for, yeah, defend the legacy of... Fourth marcher: What family is, mother, father, children and that. But we're also marching because we believe that the church is been asleep for so, asleep for so long that, you know, it's right that we, everybody else gets to have their say so it's bout time the church woke up and realised it. Wiig: So much much support is there for this conservative Christian message? How relevant is church and Christianity these days and should politicians be worried about a backlash against social legislation, such as Civil Unions and prostitution reform at the next election? In the 2001 census, about two million people declared themselves Christian. Professor of History at Massey University's Albany campus, Peter Lineham, has been studying the trend. Lineham: The total number of Christians in this society has diminished quite clearly, especially if you include the people who vaguely censused themselves to be Christians. It's now down at, the people who would use a Christian name about themselves, they're around about fifty-five percent of the population, so that's way way down from the '70's when it was in the seventy-five percent range. Wiig: In 2001 there were just over five hundred and eighty-four thousand Anglicans, four hundred and eighty-six thousand Catholics and four hundred and seventeen thousand Presbyterians, a decline in most denominations. Professor Paul Morris, from the Department of Religious Studies at Victoria University says at the same time there's been a radical growth in migrant religions. Morris: The number of Buddhists in New Zealand has increased many fold radically. There are now approximately twenty-five thousand Hindus in the country. The figures for Moslems range from thirty to forty thousand. The mainstream Christian figures are reducing all the time, both in terms of affiliation and activity. Having said that, there are pockets of growth particularly at the evangelical end of the mainstream churches and also in the independent pentecostal and smaller sectarian churches. I mean the fastest growing religion from 1996 to 2001 census was no religion which, you know, is nearly forty percent of the population. Wiig: Paul Morris says much of the growth within the pentecostal and evangelical churches has sprung from immigration. Morris: The taiwanese and Korean migrants to New Zealand, a considerable number of them are Christian. There are sizeable settlements of both the Baptist and Presbyterian churches which are Korean which have tended to be much more morally conservative. South Africans who come to New Zealand who were members of the Dutch Reformed Church. The Calvinist church in South Africa have, in New Zealand many of them have become Presbyterians and again the more evangelical end of the spectrum and with that, that, there is moral conservative views. Wiig: The pentecostal religious movement began in the early twentieth century and emphasises the holy spirit, while evangelical churches proclaim the gospel. The Christian Life centre in Auckland is an example of the new style pentecostal mega-churches springing up around the country. Christian Life Centre preacher: What a privilege, what a joy, what privilege it is to stand in your presence and when we look up to God, may we just pray that today your presence will touch every heart and God will be in open heaven and his followers will be worshipping him. For as we even talk about what you're going to be doing this year we pray that you'll stir our hearts afresh. Wiig: It's an audio-visual feast, rock music, video cameras, latest technology, not to mention the adjoining creche and childrens' sunday schools. It seems to draw in a younger crowd compared to the greying congregations of twenty years past. In the cafe in the church's foyer, which seems to be the norm for such mega-churches these days, high school students, Emma Douglas and Sarah Caldeman, explain why they like it. Douglas: I think we love the whole atmosphere of the church, how it's so like, so when you walk in you just feel welcome, so you feel like you're actually at home, and that's not just because I've been here for years, it's just that, and not it's not because I know the people, we just bring people here and they just get so amazed just about how, just by that, and also because it's so modern and there's so many youths here and they're just, because everybody's so out-going and it's such a relaxed church, it's not so, like, structured so much, you know, like.... Caldeman: I find it like, it's easy to just like worship here and, like, the fact that we get the chance to be leaders and stuff and a lot of churches you don't, you don't get to that, that until you're older, and so just getting alongside the kids and stuff i really enjoy. Wiig: But as I discovered, the growing pentecostal churches are not all about big churches and mega-sound systems. At the other end of the spectrum is the Northcote Baptist Church on the North Shore. Northcote Baptist Church preacher: Praise be to God the father and our lord, Jesus Christ, who has blessed us in the heavenly realms with every spiritual blessing in Christ. Wiig:The professor of history at Massey University, Peter Lineham, says while some conservative Christian churches like to talk about the increased size of their congregations, he believes it should not be overstated. Lineham: There's a strong tenancy in the more contemporary churches for a regular movement from church to church, getting slightly discontented, feeling uncomfortable, looking for something more and not actually really loyal to some kind of organisation, they've always been in churches that are like commercial organisations. You know, they rise, they fall, you change your flavour, you want something slightly different and you go hunting for it, and you take a break every now and then because you're angry at everybody. There's a lot of that. It's a very market-driven sector of the church and it's not an increasing market, it's a circulating market. Wiig: The Catholic Church is one of the few mainline churches that has boosted its membership while the number of Anglican, Presbyterians and Methodists have dropped. The Communications Director for the Catholic Church, Lindsay Freer, says the growth is mainly young families seeking a Catholic education for their children. Freer: There is always, I think, a falling-off of people when they leave school in their teenage years, but always a marked return when they marry and have children, they want their children to go through the Catholic school system, and our Catholic school rolls are rising steadily all the time. There's been a something like ten percent rise, I think, in the last few years. We have about two hundred and forty Catholic schools in New Zealand. Wiig: Lindsey Freer says immigration, mainly from the Philippines, a predominantly Catholic country, is also behind the rise in Catholic numbers in Auckland. She says while about fourteen percent of New Zealanders identify with the Catholic faith, only one in six Catholics attend mass regularly. Despite falling church attendance figures, the traditional Christian churches argue they are increasingly relevant in people's daily lives. Take the Salvation Army's busy community office in Manukau. First Salvation Army worker: Okay, you've done a quick assessment on this, what is your thinking here? Second Salvation Army worker: The client was actually evicted by Tenancy Tribunal, she spent the last two days waiting for help and cleaning up the premises, and so ... First worker: Do you want to challenge that, take that to the Tribunal, to challenge that or...? Second worker: It's too late. First worker: You, you had a family too, Sue, that needed emergency housing? Sue: They were kicked out by their uncle. The home is overcrowded and they were... Wiig: Salvation Army social workers here help people out of personal crises such as drug addiction, child custody battles and emergency housing situations. Major Campbell Roberts, the director of the Salvation Army's social policy and parliamentary arm, doesn't think church attendance is a measure of the health of the church. Roberts: It's about the ability to get a membership to actually connect with people in life, that is increasingly the emphasis of the more traditional churches. I think there is a degree of self-interest in some of the pentecostal-style worship and churches, and I think it's almost an extension of a sort of, a market-based economic direction which has focused people on thinking about themselves. Increasingly I find that the people who are coming to the Salvation Army are people who want to actually contribute to the wider community, who want to change things. Wiig: Lindsey Freer says the Catholic Church is also now working more closely in the community. Freer: They're now working in things like emergency housing, in family support, counselling, hospice care, food banks, that kind of thing. So it's a question of the church in its ministries changing to meet the changed needs in society. Wiig: So with the number of Christians declining overall and church attendance down, how is it that the voice of conservative Christians appears to be getting louder? Brian Tamaki: I am determined that we are not going to raise up a generation that forgets the name of the lord God almighty in this nation. Enough is enough. Wiig: Academics say fundamentalist Christians are getting more politically active and that two of the driving forces behind this are the Destiny church and the Maxim Institute. At an evening Sunday service at Destiny's headquarters in Mount Wellington, there are lots of happy and well-cared for children, mainly from Maori and Pacific families and, of course, their charismatic leader, pastor Brian Tamaki, who has recently started calling himself bishop. Tamaki: You must find a spiritual house to house your house and that your safety and your family's protection relies in getting some connections to a spiritual leader, to a pastor, to a man of God who God has formed, has chosen and has called out from the cave, and has now, goes to wherever he is so that people who know, who have been looking for a church, who are looking for a word, who are looking for a future, who are looking for some hope, can hear that word preached. Wiig: Casting an eye around the church auditorium you see sLogans boldly painted on the wall speaking of empowerment and conquest. the church has set up its own political party, Destiny New Zealand, to contest the next election. Its leader, Richard Lewis, says other attempts to get the government to listen to conservative and Christian voters have failed. Lewis: In recent times we've seen the Civil Union bill proceed in the face of overwhelming opposition. Likewise the prostitution bill and there are many more, I'm sure, on the horizon that will continue to advance in the weight of opposition from the Christian community. So it's not enough any more to lobby or make submissions or to write letters, it's about having a strong Christian-based organisation in Parliament that can strongly advocate on behalf of those voters. Wiig: Destiny New Zealand already has forty candidates ready to stand in electorate seats. Richard Lewis says the time has never been more conducive for a morals and family values based party. Lewis: We've got very seemingly intelligent government ministers who say that sole parents families can deliver as much as a healthy two-parent mum and dad family. Well, commonsense tells you that doesn't really add up, notwithstanding we've got great sole parents out there but the standard I think we need to be working towards is restoring a marriage culture whereby parents, fathers in particular, take responsibility for their own children and provide leadership and direction in the development of their kids. Wiig: Professor Paul Morris, from Victoria University, says pentecostal churches are becoming more politically savvy. He credits the Maxim Institute, an organisation that describes itself as a conservative think tank, with mobilising Christian political awareness and being good at getting publicity. Morris: What's interesting is that they are what I'm calling a Christian lobby group of an American style. They're highly organised, they seem well-funded and they have been amazingly active in lobbying MPs on a one-to-one basis with directed email campaigns. Bruce Logan (Director, Maxim Institute): Well I mean it, it depends, we use techniques that seem to work, you know, I don't, i'm a director of Maxim and I'm not conscious that we have, well in fact we haven't looked at America and said, “oh well, here's a good idea, pick this up.” But we have used ideas, structures and systems that we think will work and get our ideas out there into the public sphere because that's what we want to do. We simply want to get our ideas out in the public sphere for people to look at. Wiig:The director of Maxim, Bruce Logan, says the Institute is not a Christian organisation and its financial backers are Christian and non-Christian alike. He says the Institute does encourage lobbying of MPs on issues such as marriage, prostitution, welfare and taxation but simply wants to create debate about what a civil society is. Logan: We didn't want the state to become too powerful, we don't want any other kind of ideology to become too powerful. We'd like a balance, and one of the ways to keep that balance is to have the mediating institutions that exist between the individual and the state strong. Now the most obvious mediating institution between the individual and the state is the family, and that's one of the reasons why we're interested in having strong families. Wiig:Another group that has also been more politically active is the Vision Network, a national network of about four hundred churches, many of them pentecostal. The chief executive, Glyn Carpenter. Carpenter: Where we've done the research, for example we did extensive research on some recent legislation, and where we get a strong sense that there's a common view, then we can put that into a submission to the government. For example, we can send letters to members of parliament and we can talk to them on that basis, and so I guess you could say the function of the network is to save the churches a bit of work because we can take the combined views and put that together. Wiig: Glyn Carpenter says the network shares widely held concerns that the pendulum's swung too far away from family and Christian values. Carpenter: When we see increased families and marriages breaking up, and we see suicide rates and we see kids increasingly getting into drugs and, and there's problem activities, we see increases in the number of abortions and sexually transmitted diseases, these are things which concern most people. But we don't have a common understanding of how to fix those, and of course from the churches' perspective we would say, well our relationships with God and our connections with the church set in place those kind of fences at the top of a cliff. Wiig: Professor Paul Morris says the debate about family values has international roots, particularly as conservative Christians worldwide feel threatened by followers of Islam. Morris: Vision has played an absolute central role, both in terms of, you know, global foreign policy where there seem to be at war with Islamic militants, the Islamic terrorism. This is an unhelpful way to look at Islam, but I mean it, it's a view that has some purchase. But also George Bush's christianity, I mean it's been no secret and it's been, I mean, very much part of the way that he has sold himself to the American public, and I think those American models, I mean, have found some, some foothold, some purchase in Australia, and there are those who, who would like to see that happening here. Wiig: Promoting family values and strengthening families is a safe message that would appeal to anyone. But Max Reid, a Presbyterian minister and a member of the church's connecting with society policy group is concerned that people might buy into the message without being aware of what lies beneath the surface. Reid: The trouble is that often people will be voting based on the language rather than based on any critique of the policy that sits behind it. My concern in hearing even that kind of language though is, is that it usually belies a fairly narrow understanding of what is defined as family. The church, or no other group in society really has that, the, the right, I was going to say the God-given right to, to define how others should in turn define or understand family. Wiig: Indeed a closer look at Destiny New Zealand's web site shows policies that clearly cement the man as the leader and principal authority of the home and the wife as a supporter and nurturer. It wants incremental tax incentives the longer a couple is married and financial penalties for parents who separate. The Anglican bishop of Christchurch, David Coles, disagrees with such a stance. Coles: As a Christian I certainly don't want to identify with any policy which, which seems to punish those who are not married with children, the sort of nuclear family model which many people hold up as an ideal, there's nothing wrong with that model. But I want to recognise that always in our society we've had widows, we've had people who have lost parental support for one reason or another, we've had people who need wider support beyond their families, and in all of our churches we don't have rows and rows and rows of mum, dad and two kids. We've got single people, divorced people, people in de-facto relationships, gay and lesbian people, they're all there in our pews actually. Wiig: So should churches be involved in politics? The leader of Destiny New Zealand, Richard Lewis, certainly thinks so. Lewis: I think there is an awareness now that, especially on political issues, you can't remain silent on things that matter to you because ultimately it's our kids who have to live with the kind of decisions that have been made right now. I don't think anybody would like to see their child enter prostitution, I don't think anybody would like to see their child become an alcoholic or drug addict, well that's the sort of behaviour that's being encouraged and almost facilitated through the current government. Wiig: Presbyterian minister, Max Reid, says churches such as Destiny have every right to become politically active. But he's concerned at the extent to which they claim to be speaking on behalf of the entire Christian community. Reid: The danger I suppose is that Destiny Church or Destiny Party becomes, in the public mind, linked with the Christian church or a Christian position on certain social issues. I certainly would not want diversion of the understanding that is behind some of their policies and some of the public profile that they have received being in any way acquainted with many of the values thatI hold. My understanding of the family is, I suspect, significantly different from theirs. Wiig: Churches are no strangers to speaking out politically. In 1998 mainstream church leaders led a hikoi of hope, a nationwide march to the steps of Parliament demanding action from the then-natonal government on a set of issues including housing, poverty and employment. Since then mainstream church leaders have met regularly with the Prime Minister and cabinet members to discuss social issues with mixed success. The Salvation Army's Campbell Roberts, the convenor of the church leaders' group, says he personally doesn't think there should be exclusively Christian parties. Roberts: I think we're in a far healthier situation when we've got a mixed group of people than a political party not just dominated by one particular view. We live in a, a multi-values society and I think that each of those things needs to be held in tension against each other, there needs to be discussion. Wiig: The Anglican Bishop of Christchurch, David Coles, agrees churches should try to influence politicians on a wide range of issues. Coles: There is a perception out there that the Christian church only jumps to attention when the government is discussing what I heard somebody describe the other day as pelvic issues: sex, abortion, birth control, those sort of things, as though there were no other issues that were important. And for me there's a whole range of social justice issues which impact directly on the church and which the gospel has got things to say, like equity issues, international justice issues, peace issues. Many of these in my view are far more important for us to be working on than, than those issues about sex and individual morality issues. Wiig: So is there likely to be a backlash over some of these morality issues, such as Civil Unions and prostitution law reform, at the next election? Lindsey Freer from the Catholic Church believes churches tend to mirror middle New Zealand so she thinks there will be. Freer: There is a groundswell of concern within middle New Zealand about what we would see as social engineering that's been happening in very recent years, and we certainly made our opposition to this kind of legislation very, very well-known as have other churches, and our bishops actually made a public statement which was distributed and read at all masses shortly before Christmas last, asking people to reflect on what's been happening to this area and to take that into account when they cast their vote at the next election. And I think there will be a lot of Catholic people and a lot of middle New Zealand people who will do just that. Wiig: Presbyterian minister, Max Reid, also suspects there may be a backlash. Reid: As someone who has publicly expressed support for at least some of that legislation, I find that unfortunate. I think there will be, if you like, a front lash as well, I think there will be those who will be supportive of the current government because of the stance that it is taking in promulgating such legislation, that affirms their understanding of justice and inclusion and compassion and so on. Wiig: Campbell Roberts says Christian voters have to be careful about over emphasising one particular policy. Roberts: If you say, Civil Unions is really important but poverty is not so important or poor housing is not so important, so that I'm gong to stand against a government or stand against a political party because they did one particular policy then I think that's a very dangerous position to get yourself into. I think the Christian approach is to look at all policies and then to weigh them on balance. Our real measure is how it affects the most vulnerable in our society, and so it is about those policies which we should be actually focusing the most. Wiig: Whatever the view of churches, the proof will be in the pudding at the next election. New Zealand increasingly gets described as a secular nation but with over half the population still identifying themselves as Christian and about twelve hundred churches in Auckland alone, Christian views can't be ignored at the ballot box. Logan: The total proportion that goes to church on any sunday is about seven or eight percent. The total number that goes to church in a month is nineteen percent of the population. And people are beginning to recognise that roughly seven or eight hundred thousand people are in church in the course of a month and would regard the church connection as significant. And you see politicians have begun to recognise this. Something, you know, something pretty extraordinary is going on here and so politicians say, this could make a difference, that's when they start marketing themselves to churches. Radio New Zealand - 6th April 2005