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In regards to conversion therapy. Will your party make banning conversion therapy a government bill? Not just a member's bill? If not, why not? Yes, I want to see gay conversion therapy banned. It's disgusting. Jam made a good point. This homophobia stuff. It's some white people bullshit. This didn't exist until the church showed up and taught us. Which is really [00:00:30] fitting when we're talking about gay conversion therapy. Because last year Max Tweedy, member of the Green Party Auckland Pride he ran a petition. That was the first time in my life I've ever seen a petition backed by the youth wings of blue, red and green. And I thought, Yes, this is gonna go through And then it didn't because according to the prime Minister, it's a religious free. It infringes upon religious freedom, and I'm not certain how I went to a Catholic high school. I do not remember the part of the Bible that said, Love [00:01:00] thy neighbour. Unless they don't behave the way you want them to, then strap them to a chair and physically torture them until they do. I don't remember that bit. So yes, gay conversion therapy banned so gay conversion therapy is abhorrent. And, um uh, Labour has a member's bill, Uh, that we're very keen to make a government government bill. If we're elected as as a labour government, we would [00:01:30] support the bill. Uh, we would pass the bill to ban conversion therapy. Thank you. Uh, well, gay conversion therapy is, as you say, an abhorrent practise. The idea that we would take a young person and tell them that their sexual identity is wrong and that it has to change is just compellingly awful. Uh, our caucus doesn't have a position on it. Earlier this year, um, I was under the impression [00:02:00] that the Prime minister had rejected the member's bill and Maya Libi's name becoming a government bill. But, um, I stand to be corrected, Um, in terms of that, members Bill, I personally have, uh, examined it, and I would support it. I do know that there are people who make arguments on whether or not there would be free speech issues and whether there would be other issues. And the best way to flush that out is to take the bill to a select committee because I think we should all have an intent that gay conversion therapy should not take place in New Zealand. [00:02:30] And if that means progressing the member's bill to get to a select committee so we can get the detail of the law right, then let's do that. Yes, it's one of the policies in our policy document. And just to say for us, it's around conversion therapy, so around sexual orientation and gender identity, because it's not just around, it's not happening just around, um, sexual orientation, because we know that this isn't, um [00:03:00] and I'm a little reluctant, and I know I've been given the language to use, and I can't remember what it was. But we shouldn't even be calling it therapy because that gives it a sense of legitimacy. That is not real. It is torture, and it should be banned. Yeah, III, I agree. It's it's, um, abhorrent. It's it's effective. It's not therapy. It's not effective. And even if it were, it's disgusting. So, um, let's, um, get rid of it. I'm sure that there are some nuances [00:03:30] that have to be worked through so that you know, people can pray in the privacy of their own home and whatever, but it's it's not therapy. And it has to, um, stop. What will your party do to make schools safer for Rainbow? You young people? Right, As I just said, I went to a Catholic high school and I did kind of make it seem really bad. My Catholic high school was quite supportive despite the story. I told you earlier about not being allowed [00:04:00] to take a same sex partner to the dance. Um, they made me who I was, so I shouldn't criticise them too much. But bullying is a very, very real thing. Integrity in New Zealand do not yet have a high school education policy that's much further down the track for us. At the moment we're focused on that mental health policy. And as I said before, our mental health policy is about des stigmatising mental health in New Zealand, making sure that preventative care, like counselling, is freely available so that when you are a high [00:04:30] school student, the thought going to get help to talk to someone becomes normal, just something that every New Zealander does. Bullying in New Zealand is still a large problem, and we still have the highest rate of teen suicide in the OECD. So for us, it's about being able to provide that assistance for mental health to deal with the way the country is now. Thank you, Troy. I also came out at high school, and I can, [00:05:00] um, just say that it is so important that all Children feel that they can be who they want to be, uh, and feel safe when they are meant to be learning that is the purpose of school. It is not to enforce norms of sexuality on on anyone. Um, and, uh, I think, um, one of the pro, um, initiatives of the labour government I just like to underline is a piece of work led by Grant Robertson who, um called the Rainbow Well-being [00:05:30] Legacy Fund, which is a fund that's, uh, received some money from the government, but also donations from men, many of whom had their convictions for, um as Nicola mentioned, um uh, convictions for homosexual activity that used to be illegal, expunged and then wanted to give something. I mean, it's amazing generosity, right? Be criminalised by the state and then think, Oh, what can I give back that they have and donated to this? Um, this fund. And so the fund is [00:06:00] for, um, promoting, uh, particularly well-being projects for young people. Many community run and focused on people of school age. So that's one area where our local MP grant has led a great deal. Uh, on this issue, I just want to mention Nikki Kay, um who is a national party MP who Who is retiring, but who was the minister of education? Uh, for a few months in the last national [00:06:30] lead government and one of the initiatives, uh, she took off straight away in her short time in that role was to ensure that there was funding available for Rainbow Youth and inside out. And the reason that she did that because she had been, uh, speaking with parents and communities all over the country who had identified that it was still very difficult for young people to get assistance and support from within the rainbow community and the Rainbow community had reflected back that they wished to give that support. But there was [00:07:00] a real resourcing issue. So I just want to acknowledge that. And I want to say that that's the kind of work that I support because yes, every school should provide an inclusive environment. Every board already has a responsibility for ensuring their school is free of bullying and that Children are able to express their identity and students are able to express their identity. Every school should have in place good mental health support and good health services and good referrals. But we all know that sometimes it falls short. And when it [00:07:30] does fall short I I want to know that there are other organisations in our community that are empowered to provide specific tailored support to young people in the rainbow community. Uh, and I think supporting organisations like Inside Out and Rainbow Youth is a good way to go. Um, So, as I said before, I think you know, one thing that we can do that can be really helpful is stop this kind of weird practise of forcing little Children to be in one of two categories. And and that is all, um, a thing happened [00:08:00] recently, unfortunately to my 11 year old who's at at intermediate school, where she was, um, called a homophobic slur and she came home pretty upset about it, and I contacted the school and was like guys guys. And they said, Well, we're gonna cover, um, inclusion in term four. And I was like, OK, so we're gonna wait until the Children are 12 to teach them not to be raging assholes. That feels a little late [00:08:30] to me. Um, but what they have done is my daughter and her friends have started a spectrum club, as in the rainbow spectrum, and the school is supporting them with that. So they are gonna make, um, make posters and hold events. So I What I would like to see is that that, um, you know, that kind of education comes way way younger 12 is just far, far too late to stop people treating each other like this. [00:09:00] Yeah, we We've still got a lot of work to do on this, right? The, um, greens a couple of terms ago, did a review of the school's policies, um, and, um, and then went and kind of tried to check how they were. And And the outcome of that work was really Grimm. Lots of schools who, um, said they didn't have any [00:09:30] queer students. Yep. A lot of this, uh, you know, which is the starting point? Still for many of our schools is because they don't know what they don't know. And we have to make sure that the resources there, from the resource for our community organisations um to be working in tools to help them go through that whole transformation about looking at their policies, their toilets, [00:10:00] their curriculums, their sexuality, relationship, education and their anti-bullying practise as well as policy. Um and that needs, I think, ideally would be helped if that was supported, um, by a team within government to be able to help that expertise in the Ministry of Education as well as at a local level through our organisations, um and that we really need to back that up, where [00:10:30] it's that leadership is owned by the school leaders and the work is done with the boards of trustees and the parents to take them on that journey of understanding. Um and we know that actually, a lot of people still don't know that they know anyone who's trans and so there's a lot of work to be done for helping parents in particular as well as school teachers and leaders to understand these issues, to be able to step [00:11:00] into their leadership. There's so much more we could do and I think the results would be really exciting. I deserve um everyone round applause again for 10 minutes. Rao for hosting us for hosting a queer friendly space. Um so the next question is the 2020 budget has seen a significant cut for the Rainbow communities. [00:11:30] What actions we need to take on to ensure that this does not happen again. And how will your party improve funding and support for rainbow organisations around the country who are stretched for capacity and primarily volunteer led? It's disappointing to hear that when we actually have a gay finance minister as well. Rainbow organisations need support and they need help as much as every other community organisation you may have noticed they tend to get quite angry about queer rights. Some of you know that [00:12:00] more than others. Can you imagine me in parliament? When that gets comes through and they go, here's the budget. This is what the budget's gonna be. We're gonna give this amount of pride to Auckland. Can you imagine me being hm? That's decreased. I'm not exactly gonna stand there and take it quietly. So you put me in parliament. You've got me standing there yelling and making a lot of noise about it. That's what I'm going to do to make sure it doesn't happen again. Yeah, it was, um I did seek clarification from about [00:12:30] about this because I'm surprised to hear that there is a cat and II. I think it would be, um, be good to get more specification about what's precisely meant because, uh, there was funding introduced over four years in the last budget for, um, for rain communities. And so that's intended to be ongoing. I think the other thing I would point to is grants for Rainbow communities are often in the scheme of the government's budget, quite small. And the place that I'm most interested in us leveraging our power is to make sure [00:13:00] that all of the, uh, various ministries votes are working for us and in particular in health and education and in housing. And I think that's an important priority. So that relates to some of my work on the district health board where, um uh. So, for example, the district Health Board gives hundreds of millions of, um contracts to um or organisations and the community. And so um, simply by making well, not simply, it's a remarkable how seldom it's done. But [00:13:30] by making sure that, say, the grants that are going to community organisations to promote Pacific health, for example to make sure that they are inclusive of the rainbow community can have a a very big impact as well. And I'm eager to see that sort of work continue. Thank you. Unusual and possibly dangerously. Um, I'm going to admit that I, too, wasn't aware that there had been specific cuts in funding to the rainbow uh, community. [00:14:00] Um, but look on a first principles basis. Um, National fundamentally believes in community run initiatives and in, uh, initiatives being run by non-government organisations. We don't think that government initiative is the solution to every problem. We think that sometimes, uh, some issues are best dealt with by those on the ground with the strongest connections and relationships with the people who they are seeking to support and assist. So we [00:14:30] have a record across successive governments of empowering and enabling non-government organisations rather than simply just growing government departments to do the work. I also just want to say that we take This debate is taking place in the context of a global pandemic with a massive economic downturn that is happening around the world. And each of us need to be conscious going into this election that the things that we fundamentally believe in in terms of increasing funding for health, [00:15:00] increasing funding for education, ensuring this is an economy where people have jobs and can afford a house actually depends on us managing this economy. Well, the national has a strong track record out of the global financial crisis of continuing to do that. We did that well, then and I will stand proudly, uh, on that record that we increased government spending following the last global downturn. And we've committed that we would do that again. Uh, so I make that point because it's going to be important in this election campaign. [00:15:30] I would I would hazard to say that with $31 billion going into infrastructure projects for which there aren't even business cases, that we could probably spare a little bit for rainbow communities, uh, for you know, from which the community gets excellent value for money. Grassroots organisations give incredible value for money for New Zealand and for the government. Um so the first thing we would do at top is, as [00:16:00] I've said, give every person $250 as a week as a universal basic income, no questions asked Now that acknowledges the unpaid work of the people working in all of these organisations. If you want to reduce your working hours, if you're able to not work, no one's gonna be requiring you to, uh, show up to MS D to show how you're, um, trying to trying to get off your benefit. You're entitled to that $250. And if you can use that to support your community, then that is incredible. [00:16:30] And we would love to see that, Um, in addition to the the money that we could be spending a little bit a little bit, um, better, I'd say I'm so I'm so sorry that New Zealand first isn't here because $70 million for race horses. Um, again, I don't think this is a shortage of money. Problem. Um, so just so. My understanding is that last budget, possibly [00:17:00] possibly for the first time, he'd ever had visible budget lines for funding for LGBT Q i initiatives and that the cut is about the fact that there weren't any new initiatives in this budget for our communities. So the initiatives in the last budget, I think, um, included the Rainbow Legacy Fund. Um, that Doctor Veres mentioned um which is providing [00:17:30] small amounts of funding for our community organisations. But it's not a it's not mean as a mechanism for funding our organisations. It's actually just a way of acknow alleging the harm that was done to our communities when gay men were criminalised and paying it forward to the next community. And it's kind of an absence of reparations to those men they've chosen to pay it forward to in this way for the next generation, which [00:18:00] is a beautiful act of generosity on behalf of those men. And Grant, I will acknowledge this late, um, been critical in achieving that and and it was also around, um there being the gender affirming health care and that's as we you all know, possibly too well and we know in a frustrating level we haven't managed to get that money spent yet into surgeries and in government. You can't get more money when you haven't spent the money that you've got, it's like, yeah, [00:18:30] And then it was also for, um the in my portfolio area around addressing family and sexual violence was specific funding for prevention projects within LGBT QI a communities because we know, um, that we have very high levels of family violence and sexual violence within our community, and there has been zero acknowledgement of that in the past. And in fact, there's been all of the incentive for us [00:19:00] because of homophobia and transphobia to hide that, to be able to protect ourselves in the world. So I'm really proud to have got that money. But it's a journey to be able to get the public service resourced and working with our communities to deliver on it, which is one of the reasons, like from my experience of this of wanting to get an agency to help drive that work, to be able to get the next level of funding [00:19:30] quicker because we know we need it. And I also think that there is more funding going out through MS D that's not visible in the budget lines. I think Auckland Outline has been funded by government for the first time in the covid response, and I think that's really encouraging. It's just we don't have visibility of it. And and I think if we can get the agencies making sure they recognise we're there and responding the putting the funding [00:20:00] to us, that's good. But it's not secure. Um, communities are disproportionately affected by sexual and intimate partner violence. How will your party address the need for this? Specifically, the sexual and domestic violence are Think something in two different parts of my community is the community is overrepresented. So, too, is the Maori community. [00:20:30] So it's something that I've had a lot of time to reflect on and to think about. Our mental health policy goes quite far towards trying to destigmatize the seeking of help for mental health. One of the things about domestic violence is that when you're in that situation, there is the desire to normalise it, to rationalise it, to say things like it's my fault. They are angry because I did this or to just accept that you shouldn't have done it and somehow blame [00:21:00] yourself. One of the hardest and most difficult things about domestic help, uh, domestic violence is is finding help and finding people to talk to about it, to actually have those conversations and to accept No, this isn't normal. I don't deserve this. Which is why that mental health policy des stigmatising finding help is something that we want to get through as soon as we can. Yeah, [00:21:30] I totally agree with what's just been said, but I also want to acknowledge in talking about the, um, talking about sexual and domestic violence. Just the amazing work that Jen has done on this issue. Um, I think Jen was working in this space outside of Parliament when I met her 20 years ago, and continues to be an important, uh, amazing advocate on these on these issues and collaborating with the Greens. Labour has supported a number [00:22:00] of initiatives which I'm gonna try and list. And then Jen can correct me because she's she's been, uh, uh closely involved in all of them. So in our first, um, budget of this government, there was funding frontline, uh, services. And so that was 2018 and 2019. Increased, um, increased that and further emphasis on specific campaigns to, uh, prevent, uh, violence. There's been legislative change that prevents, um, the, uh, re traumatization of, uh, victims by questioning about their sexual [00:22:30] history. That is a bill that labour has, uh, supported. And, um, also, as I mentioned earlier efforts to make, um, uh, engagement with police are easier through the, um, uh uh, presence of diversity, Um, liaison officers who should be making sure that police forces in every region are, um, accessible to to queer people. So an important area of work and absolutely important one for our community. Thank you. [00:23:00] Uh, this is an area of work that, uh, both Amy Adams and an Tolley. Previous National Party ministers, uh, did a lot of work on because, uh, they recognised that New Zealand has a very poor record in terms of the rates of victimisation, both in terms of domestic violence and sexual violence. One of the initiatives that, uh, they took on, and I believe Jan that you've continued to build on was around cross agency response work. So acknowledging that often [00:23:30] people who are victims of these crimes or who are affected by this kind of violence, um, have contact with numerous government agencies AC, C, the police MESD many other agencies. And yet no one agency will sometimes pick up on the whole some of their problems and help them with the additional support that they need. So they had a, uh, a cross agency initiative that was really successful and that I believe this government has continued to build on. And I know that that kind of work is really important because we shouldn't [00:24:00] treat people like silos. People who have an issue in the health system most likely are also having, uh, an issue somewhere else. And these kinds of issues might pop up in the health system. They might pop up as a housing need. They may pop up, uh, in the police system, and we need to make sure our government agencies look at the whole problem and not just a slice of it. They, uh, was with the women's refuge on Friday, helping collect, um, money from the public who are incredibly generous. And they said to me that here in Wellington, part of why they feel they're [00:24:30] able to do really good work is because the police that they work with are so incredibly responsive and interactive, and I want to see that kind of relationship across the country, where those working to support victims of violence, both sexual and physical, are really well supported in positive partnerships with the police and other government agencies. One of the huge contributors to domestic and sexual violence is, um, mental, ill health and and and a lot of that [00:25:00] comes from stress, particularly housing, stress and financial stress. As I said, and I say over and over again, housing is the major cause of poverty and equality and stress in New Zealand. Uh, another problem that we have in New Zealand is under our current, um, benefit system. Once you've been basically having sex with somebody for six weeks, you're tied to them financially and that allows, um, financial abuse. You what you get depends on what your partner gets [00:25:30] so universal. Basic income is for an individual, so you can leave, and you can leave with your for money. You don't have to consult. You can get away, um, safely so reducing that that stress from poverty, supporting people as individuals and properly fund that funding the organisations that support people in these situations is incredibly important to us. Um, just I know [00:26:00] that um, poverty is a driver of some forms of family violence, but I just really want to challenge that. It's the key driver because actually, domestic violence and sexual violence exist in super wealthy families. It is not a product of poverty. Um, and so in response to this question is like, I'm it's gonna be a challenge for me because I can talk for days on this. It's [00:26:30] like this is an entrenched form of harm in our society that we have to fundamentally reshape the way that we work to be able to end it. And I Absolutely the first step is believing you can end it to the point where it's an aberration rather than the norm, which is what many of us experience at the moment. And I believe that and this government has committed to that work. It is not a side issue for us. This government [00:27:00] has made it a priority and has created a position for the first time with a sole focus on that work. Um, in terms of making sure that it's accessible for us, I will say that in my role. So the reason for the funding for the prevention work was to establish the relationships between the public service and our community organisations to help upskill the public service around this and to start creating the [00:27:30] pathways for people to be able to disclose and get help. Because for a long time we've been relying on a mainstream response to family and sexual violence and assuming it's going to work for everybody despite people's experience of discrimination in the system, that is a significant barrier for a lot of people reaching out for help despite an internalised homophobia or a transphobia that people experience. We've pretended that that's not [00:28:00] a reality and just experience. Expect people just to come forward and tell somebody in the normal way that anybody else wouldn't expect that to work for them. And it doesn't and we have to create pathways and connect in to where people are telling people and put the resource around that for people to be able to get the help. And that is what we are currently doing work on building and there is some really exciting stuff happening. So also includes, [00:28:30] uh, accommodation, Um, because we know that actually women's refuges that's accessible to women, that's trans women but identifying there will be a barrier for many Trans women wanting to go into Oh, there's so much to say as well. Thank you so much for that. It's just, um we've come to the last question for the evening. Um, but all of you, um, that will open [00:29:00] up the floor to questions as well. And obviously the candidates will be here. Um um after the forum as well. The last question is, will your party make banning non life preserving surgery on BS C slash intersex individual specifically underage minors a government priority resulting in legislative change? If not, why not? And also support the development of training models and ongoing lectures series for all medical and health professionals across [00:29:30] try. So this is where I get really confused you've got. About 10 years ago, there was a TV show called Nip Tuck. If anyone remembers that, I mean, this is not a good example, but but nip up. And they covered a topic known as genital mutilation. The idea was that all the the what had happened was the character had been raised in an under POed country where she had had part [00:30:00] of her genitalia forcibly removed as a child because that's the religious practise that existed there. And we in the Western world term that genital mutilation and call it a crime against humanity. But in New Zealand, when we do it in a surgery to a child who has just been born for some reason, we call it genital normalisation, as if intersex people, when they're born slightly different, are somehow unusual or unnatural. I always find [00:30:30] this incredibly bizarre because intersex to me, is the black and white evidence that gender is not binary, that people are born in a different way, and it's clear and plain cut. You can see this. I do not understand why this has not been adopted. Additionally, it is also covered by the United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child, which New Zealand is a signatory to. So it should be added to our Bill of Rights, and this [00:31:00] nonlife threatening surgery should be banned. Thank you. Yeah. So, um, intersex is natural. It is part of nature, and therefore it is not a disease and surgery, for it is not a conventional form of surgery to treat an illness, is it? So I don't believe my personal view is that it is not, uh, not the right thing to do. And I think, um, uh, the [00:31:30] one of the things that, um um in the round table report into, um intersex is the importance of establishing a clinical network to look at this issue. Um, which, uh, has been done over the last two years, the Ministry of Health has been funded to, um, set up how an intersex clinical network would work. And I want to, um, answer why? I think, uh, that is an important way, way forward, and not just to focus [00:32:00] on the, um, banning of surgery, which, as I've said I am against. But I think as a, um there are some complications about it. So the first point about, um, the surgery is that surgery, um, intersects. People need surgery for other reasons, just like anyone else might on their genitals. And so I, um, not always. But sometimes, for example, if they have a condition, uh, that might make a baby who's insect more at risk of getting [00:32:30] urinary tract infections, where all surgeons, all Children with that condition, would need treatment on it. There's also a condition called hyper, which, um, Children can be born with including intersex, um, including some intersex Children. And they might need a surgery to prevent cancer. So I think that makes it very difficult to have, um, to have a a clear view, um, about how the law would decide that. But as I've said, it is my view, and I think the view of many professionals who work in the area, [00:33:00] um, as surgeons that this is not appropriate surgery. So the clinical network plan is about getting that idea of what is good and acceptable practise disseminated across our health system. So it doesn't just mean that, um say in, uh centres where there is access to good specialists who are up on latest practise, that that is known, that wherever you're born, you should be able to be treated treated appropriately, and that means not having surgery. [00:33:30] The second thing that's important here is good care for intersex people isn't just about not having surgery. A person who's born into sex might require support for them and their families throughout their growing up and adolescence. And so good care isn't just about something we fix with a bill. It's about having standards appropriate. Practise a professional community that's educated and present all across the country. It actually goes to quite a, um, important issue in our health [00:34:00] system, which is that we don't achieve consistent standards of practise in one DH B to the next. Right. So you might if you're born in Auckland or Wellington and you're an intersex baby, you might have access to a, um, to a specialist who is up on these issues, but you might not somewhere else. And so some I'm finishing some of the reforms that the Simpson report is trying to do is to allow these collaborations to occur across the health system and make it least fragmented. [00:34:30] And that is so important for rare conditions affecting small groups of people, essentially minorities. Well, I just want to acknowledge we have the expert speaking on that one. so I don't have too much more to to offer except to say that there is evidence that some people's lives have been inextricably harmed by this practise. It's made it very difficult for them growing up. Uh, it's created difficulties in their relationships with their parents [00:35:00] and, of course, that's entirely regrettable, and we don't want that to happen. Um, I believe that every parent presented with their new baby loves that baby absolutely, and wants the absolute best for them. So it's really important that the medical experts they're working with are actually guided by best practise. And so, to that point, um, I I bow to what Aisha is saying about the need for clinical leadership in this area to make sure that any intervention is actually evidence based and is it [00:35:30] occurs with respect for the child and their health and isn't brought about because of some wrongheaded idea of putting people into one box or another. Um, just briefly, it is absolutely core to everything we do at top that we, um, listen to the experts. And in this case, uh, we would be talking about medical experts and also the people with the lived experience of being intersex, and we would just do what that expertise says, and it [00:36:00] sounds pretty pretty clear what that is, and I'm certain we would support that. And the greens have been involved just a little bit in terms of the work that's been happening in the conversations and the facilitated conversation between the health professionals and the intersex community and the Human Rights Commission. Um, and we would support the legislation. Um, and the reason for that is that, of course, [00:36:30] it has to be designed in a way that doesn't prevent life saving, medical intervention or medical intervention to, um, prevent significant health problems. And that's the recommendation of the Human Rights Commission that we have legislation that stops non-essential surgical interventions on intersex babies. And they are recommending that after years of [00:37:00] those discussions and having sat in on some of those discussions, and they were admittedly mostly early on some of the gap between some of the health professionals and the intersex community, even around definitions of what is intersex, the gaps were wide. And for the Green Party, our starting point is the experience of those who live with the consequences. [00:37:30] Medical expertise is critical, but it can't always lead the way because that is what has led to non necessary medical intervention and the point around the training and getting that in. Because it's right, legislation by itself would not be enough. It's always got to be backed up by the cultural change and the training and the resources. And the question was, would we support government rolling that out? There's a bit of an issue in terms of [00:38:00] the independence of our tertiary institutions. Um, it is really important that government does not tell our tertiary institutions what to do, But we can absolutely be engaging around guidelines and ensuring that there are resources and putting more behind and political resource behind those conversations and ensuring that the resource is there. Because, um, you know what? Some of what has happened in the past and is still happening is horrific, [00:38:30] and it needs to end. Thank you very much. Um, the floor, Two questions. We've got 15 minutes. Should we start with, uh, So what is your party doing to support Rainbow Youth? And, like, who are in your youth wings? We're giving them lots of opportunities to put up hoardings and deliver flyers. [00:39:00] Um, but seriously, I think one really important thing all political youth wings are confronting is how we make sure that people's what is often their first experience in politics is a positive experience with their contribution is respected and occurs in safe spaces. And we have um, initiated a policy to make sure that all our social, uh, events are safe. And they, um uh, and alcohol is not present at youth events and that [00:39:30] there are harassment contacts at, uh at, um, party events as well. So that's, um, uh, that's where we're starting from. Well, actually, our youth wing, the young Nets, is what gives me absolute confidence that a future national Party caucus will have more representation from the rainbow community. Because looking at our young supporters coming through, there is a lot of diversity amongst our young nets. Um, in fact, uh, not the current, uh, president. [00:40:00] But our two previous, uh, leaders of the young Nets were members of the rainbow community. Uh, and and I think it falls to us as it does with every organisation, to make sure that we provide inclusive opportunities for people to be involved and contribute, and that we listen to those challenging voices. And as one of you mentioned earlier tonight, I think you Troy, um, our youth wing does actually advocate for things. So, um, the young Nats came out very strongly in support of Maya [00:40:30] Lubis Bill to ban gay conversion therapy Uh, and we enable our youth wing to do that. They should have a voice on the issues that matter to them. Uh, and they should be a voice for activism and influence on our party. So integrity New Zealand is in a unique position out of all of these parties because we don't actually have a youth wing. We're too new for that. So when we get really awesome young people who understand politics and want to learn more about it, we just put them on our campaign teams so that they can learn directly. [00:41:00] Thank you, Sophie, for the question. So I what we're doing about Rainbow Division, though I have a campaign team of six running my campaign for including myself and of them, we have one token straight person, and that's it. Oh, no, I don't look so good. I was about to Skype that, you know, we've got four queers in our top [00:41:30] 10, and we've got nine rainbow candidates, and only two of us aren't young. Um, so pretty smug. Thanks. Um, but I think, really, And the one of the co convenor of the, um, young greens is and it's like that is a space within our party that is just so down with diversity on every kind of level. And they are really [00:42:00] one of the main things is kind of how to create inclusion and, uh, one of the kind of the models in the party as well as fierce campaigners and activists. So, um, usually we just kind of roll with the energy of it and try and and jump on board. Yeah, just briefly. We We're a grassroots party, and but basically, our our youth members are as involved as our older members. So they're not in a in a [00:42:30] separate wing there. We're all in it together. And our basic philosophy is, um we're very, um uh, devolved. And like, the previous incarnation of top, um, So, uh, what? What? How you, um, members want to do? Um, we'll we'll let them do as long as it broadly aligns with our, um Nicola. My question is directly for you today. Um, Jerry Brownley, the deputy leader of the National [00:43:00] Party, voted against the civil Union bill in 2004 and the Marriage Amendment act in 2013 and at the reading of the Marriage Amendment Act said Quote. The question is, why would one want to recognise a law? A group of people who have said for so long they want to be recognised as different but are now saying they want to be treated the same as other people? In my view, the sad fact is, although some will find this difficult to take, they are not the same. While you've done a great job at talking the talk today, how are we supposed to believe [00:43:30] or vote for you when one of the people at the helm of your party, frankly, forgive my French does not give a shit about queer people? Um, I'm I'm not here to explain the workings of people's minds a decade ago when they made statements. But what I can do is I can judge Judith Collins and Jerry Brownley from what are [00:44:00] the actions that I have seen from them, And I believe that they are both people who treat human beings with dignity and with respect, who operate in an inclusive way and who do celebrate diversity. I judge them by their actions. I'm proud to be led by them, and I am proud to be a voice and our caucus that believes absolutely. And the rights of individuals, no matter what the gender, sexuality or expression is, I will continue to stand strongly for that. Whether or not you attack [00:44:30] me, whether or not you've got nasty things to say about my party, I will continue to stand here and be that voice. Thank you. OK, so I actually have two questions. The first one is about sex, Ed. And do you support teaching the sex ed in school? Especially queer sex ed and enforcing that that it be taught, especially in Catholic schools, Because I shouldn't have had learned through Tum Tumblr about my own sexuality and [00:45:00] my own gender identity. Yeah, so that question is for all candidates, and there is one following up after this. Thank you. Ok, well, I'll answer the first one first. Um, yeah, my understanding is that the boards of trustees, um, set this policy, but I don't really understand why we would think it was a good thing for Children to go through life without basic education about their, [00:45:30] um this. You know how their how their bodies work and how relationships work. So, yeah, I I've been really appalled at how little my Children at secular schools have got. And it's, um it's not good enough. In my opinion, Do you want us to all go through and then do the second one? Oh, that was the first question, right? Yes. So the first question that definitely, uh, too much of my professional life [00:46:00] has, um, brought me into contact with people who, um, for whom? Sex education was, uh, something that, um, was overlooked. Treated with shame and stigma. And, um, and lead people into, uh, situations where, um they couldn't live free and full happy life. So, yes, Absolutely. Um, my view is that the, uh, really good curriculum that we have on paper should be a reality in all of our schools. [00:46:30] Same. Um, and you know, my I had a youth MP last term. So, like, four years ago, who was at school, and she was in a Catholic school, young, bisexual woman. And the main takeaway she had from her, um, school sex ed was the exercise to describe her ideal husband in this day and age. Like, that's inexcusable, and and, um, and at the moment, there's no real way of challenging that. [00:47:00] Thank you for mentioning Catholic education because I had a teacher at high school who told me that the best form of contraception was abstinence. It's not contraception. That's not how it works. Yes, we need better sex ed in schools. Six, is there in the curriculum and where it where it's described in the curriculum. It's meant to be inclusive, and it's meant to be good. Um, but I think we have to hold individual school boards accountable for delivering on what's [00:47:30] there in the curriculum. And I actually think we, as parents, have a really important job. We actually have the job of where we see schools not doing a good enough job in this area of going to our boards and asking that they do. And we also have a job as parents of having these conversations at home. You know, my kids are 10, 87 and four, and we've started these conversations. Uh, and I know that these conversations are gonna get a lot harder, but I feel a personal responsibility to go and get the information [00:48:00] about how I do it Well, because I don't just want to delegate it to teachers. I, as a mother feel a real personal responsibility to do it as well. So the second question is quite topical with recent events. So, um, with the youth scandals coming out of the youth wings, do you support the removal of those the harassers in the youth wing? Sorry. So the abuse scandals and sexual violence in the youth thinks, Do you support [00:48:30] the removal of the per perpetrators that cause those harms? Especially if it's cross party between the youth wings? Um, that is for, um, all everyone if you want to answer it, but particularly towards the young Nats, because from my own experience, I have had someone from the young Nats harass me, and he's still involved with the young Nats today. Well, I'm certainly, um, shocked to hear that. Um, I hope that you have been able to [00:49:00] bring your story forward. Uh, and I'm really happy to speak with you afterwards about how I can support you to do that. Um, we want involvement in our political party to be safe and anyone involved, and it should be free from any form of harassment. Um, And so if that hasn't been the case, for you. I would like to talk to you about that. Thank you very much. And just to say that this is a challenge for, um us as a country [00:49:30] and that, um and that we all have to be working on making sure that the environments and groups that we're part of whatever they are are safe spaces free from sexual harassment. And that sounds like a nice, tidy sound bite. Right? It is. But that takes a lot of work. You've got to develop good policies and make sure that everyone understands them and has the confidence and the backing [00:50:00] to be able to follow them. So the greens have revitalised our sexual harassment policy and created a new one. And they're going through a process of developing E training for all of our leaders right across the country to be able to make sure that that doesn't just sit as a policy and a piece of paper, but as a live document to protect everyone within our organisation because we need to work and be actively involved in creating [00:50:30] a safe society. And that's on all of us. I'm sorry of your experience. Yeah, I I'd just like to add to the comments that it's unacceptable to have sexual harassment in, um, youth wings or actually, in po politics, Uh, including in our parliament. Thank you. Um, I'd like to thank you. Sorry, I didn't get your name for asking that question. And also thank you, Nicola, for responding in a compassionate manner. I really appreciate that. Genuinely. [00:51:00] And I hope that you'll be able to discuss after the forum and get some resolution. Um, next up, what have we got? Um, what will your party be doing to ensure that disabled rainbow people get the same access to services and support that the wider Rambo community do is often were considered to be an afterthought in rainbow issues despite being widely overrepresented. I mean, I think that, uh, topic [00:51:30] is about addressing, um, you know, fundamental issues. And I know, and I know that support for all all people with disabilities is is, um, a fundamental problem. So, I mean, we just We take the approach we take with everything, which is to, um, listen to the communities and listen to experts on what we can do, but also, um, addressing those fundamentals of, um uh poverty and housing poverty are are our priorities. But I would really love to talk to you afterwards. About what? Could, um what [00:52:00] you would like to see us do as well, I, I think, um uh, I can't give a specific answer, but I will give two general principles that I think are very important. One is your question related specifically to services? I mean, it is not OK that we spend billions of budgets through health and education, um, to provide services that are inaccessible. And the second thing is that people, uh, with disability should [00:52:30] be leaders of service provision. And it's a really important concept that we are starting to have the beginnings of. I know in the health sector, uh, we're starting to begin to provide, uh, services. And if I think back to my day and time in medical school, um, we actively I mean, there were there were so many barriers to students with disabilities coming, for example, um, people who were in wheelchairs [00:53:00] who for the first time had to access our buildings, had to go in the goods entrance to get into our our medical school. And that is those sorts of barriers need to be broken down so that we are providing services for people led by people. Um, with with disability who therefore can provide an acceptable and open, you know, accessible service to everyone. Um, yeah. This is like it's about being intersectional, isn't it about actually recognising that we don't [00:53:30] live in queer lives, disabled lives? Um, migrant community lives, You know that. Actually, people, we're a mix of a range of experiences, and our services need to respond to that. And, um, break down some of those silos and I. I just want to do a little and this and we are working in the work that I'm doing to try and, like, work, get into that. And there's a huge amount of work to do because that's not [00:54:00] how government traditionally works. And I do just want to do a little shout out to the community on this because I was part of, um, the Human Rights Commission and the Rainbow Cross Party group has a, um, meeting with the community every few months, months, and we had to catch up after covid. And I've got to say, like I wish every single person in this room could have been part of that because I came away just so incredibly proud of our communities. [00:54:30] We heard about the experience of Maori and older queers and people with disabilities and Children and the all the range of our sexualities and people from migrant communities and Pacifica communities within this LGBT Q I space. And it was just the reflection of our beautiful diversity beyond our letters. And, um and I think it is about, for example, of [00:55:00] the government stepping back down into the community to take the leadership from where the real practise change is happening, which is with you, and we just need to be, I think, resourcing and supporting and learning from that because it was super inspiring to me. Sorry, we've only got two microphones. Uh, the short answer is [00:55:30] talking to your community finding out what you need and how to best do that, making sure your community has representation as involved in the process to give you a bit of a rundown on my own history of working with, um, communities who are disabled. Um, for those of you who don't know my full time job, I work in a Theatre down the road. My contract says I'm not allowed to name it or talk about it, but it has the same name as a flying animal and we, yeah, that's a weird [00:56:00] one to get around. So, uh, we've been doing a lot of work in this space specifically for communities who are disabled, in particular for those who are visually impaired. Those who have trouble with hearing those who are movements impaired to try and work on ways to make this more accessible. And I think that needs to go into every aspect of New Zealand life because we should all be able to participate in our society [00:56:30] wherever possible. Government should strive to deliver services that are tailored to people's specific needs. Uh, and I know in Government National, uh, tried to implement part of that approach through the enabling Better Lives programme, giving disabled people control over their own resources and services to which they're entitled, but not just giving them the cookie cutter government solution, allowing them to put together the support and services that work for them. But I'm actually really interested in your answer to this question, so I'd appreciate [00:57:00] the opportunity Uh, to catch up afterwards to hear your views on how government can do better in this area. Oh, thank you so much. Uh, sorry. I'll have to get all Christian people to come to me because I don't Hi. Um, sorry. Um, it's so awesome to come to this event. It's my first one in Wellington. Um, I was really interested in your responses to how, what? What your parties are doing to support queer [00:57:30] communities of colour. And I was disappointed because not one answer referred to actual direct policy, which is really interesting because currently, Minister, um, Minister Little has talked about a hate speech review back last year. When March 15th happened, I don't know what's happened with that. That in itself is not enough. Whereas the UK has the equalities Act 2010, which 10 years ago, which covers everybody who is a minority based on race, [00:58:00] ethnicity, Geno, sexuality, all those things. We don't have that here. And it's not enough for you guys to say, you know, you support it, but what are you actually doing? Because racism isn't new. BLM isn't new, So I need to know what your direct policy is I need to know from doctor Burro. What is taking so long with the hate with the hate speech of review? And I don't want to hear that we've got a balanced freedom of expression because in the same, um, Bill of Rights Act is the freedom of discrimination from M minorities. So that trumps freedom of expression. That's my [00:58:30] first question. Is that OK? Cool. Yeah. I mean, um, the you I totally accept that, um what you've hate speech is real. Racism is real. And, um, uh, this is an important area. Labour is working on its policy on this and, uh, you right to identify that we have been delayed by some of these difficult issues. I am not going [00:59:00] like you. I do not accept Uh um the, um uh excuse that. Um, uh, freedom of speech prevents us from doing anything in this area, but it does mean that we have to do a lot of homework to make progress. And that is the stage that we are at. Yeah, I'm sorry if I didn't answer that question. Well, uh, we are a small party, and there are a lot of issues we don't have, um, policies on. But our policy for a written constitution absolutely [00:59:30] is going to be talking about, um, ethnicity. Like there's there's there's no doubt. Um, but what we what we do in concrete terms now, as we seek out any area where there are, um, real effects on people's lives. So, for instance, our, um the reason we support legalisation and regulation of cannabis and the reason we support a massive overhaul of our justice system is because it disport disproportionately hurts people of colour. So those that's what we do [01:00:00] have, um, in terms of concrete policy, but we don't have a policy on hate speech. I mean, but, you know, I know what it would be if we had one, but we have a small set. Sorry. I thought I had articulated, um, quite a few policies in response to this. So one, we do have the view around hate speech. And until you came by, nobody else. Ok, All right. So do I. I [01:00:30] won't repeat. Ok, um the the Bill of Rights, This is absolutely not an excuse, and it needs to be improved. So the Bill of Rights has a little segment about hate speech and why it's prohibited, but it needs. It needs more teeth. It doesn't have enough here in New Zealand. It's kind of just don't say mean things. And that's kind of all the legislation in this country is, and that needs to be improved as well. Improving the Bill of Rights [01:01:00] is something that is currently being talked about at integrity in New Zealand, but we haven't yet got the policy put together for it. But even if you improve the bill of Rights, if someone assaults me, um and I know it's because I'm black It doesn't matter when I go to the police because it's an aggravating factor. It's not the factor. So the police have to remember to put it as a catch and summary and refer to the bill of they're not. They don't do that. And I know this because I have a friend in the police who says they don't do this. So the Bill of Rights Act is a fluffy piece of policy. It's not half [01:01:30] legislation which actually has, um uh, clauses on prosecution. You actually need a law like an actual piece of ledge, and I don't understand. It's just so easy to say. Yeah, we'll look into this because it's not new. I. I don't Yeah. Same thing happened with my sister court for a joint in her pocket. One tiny little piece of cannabis that if she was white, also wouldn't have happened. And sorry, um, Nico, before [01:02:00] you answer, I also No, no, I want you to answer. But I also want to preface what I really want you to address what Judith Collins said about wiping the list as well, because that's the most offensive thing. One of the most offensive things I say. So when you say you stand by your your political leader and you stand for BMW, what do you what's your take on that? I believe that all ethnicities should be treated equally and where they're not treated equally. That that's not acceptable. [01:02:30] Thank you. Alright. Did you? Oh, you've got one more question. Did you wanna take a take a break and then we'll go to someone else's person? No. Alright, Off we roll and final question is just in a reference to the police because, um, doctor, you talked about having diversity officers. Um but I just, uh I mean, what for? All for all of you. Um, what would you do if with regards to police, cultural competency [01:03:00] and the systemic racism, transphobia, homophobia, biphobia and trans misogyny in the police force, particularly among new recruits, it was so trigger happy and tend to be young, male white guys who don't understand what it's like to be a person of any sort of difference. What would you do to make sure they are trained up adequately to deal with minority communities And, um, to also not get their pants in the twist because they're not allowed to march in uniform at Auckland [01:03:30] Pride because they've done nothing to support quick metres of colour? Thank you. I think that it's it's a good step that, um, there's the discussion happening around that, um, systemic racism exists within the police and that that, you know, has been confirmed by the data. And, um, you know, the police commission has been given that [01:04:00] the right data. Now finally, to confirm that, um, and we need to make sure that there is a training response to that and that I also personally believe we can't just leave it to training. It's also about building the relationships in the community, to have an eye on the practise and to be able to feed back examples of when things are going wrong, that people [01:04:30] in the community, if they experience harassment or discrimination, that they've got a trusted person in their community who has a kind of a a phone line to people who can actually respond and try and correct when things go wrong, because getting consistent practise and overcoming embedded generations of structural discrimination is not a quick fix. And we've got to start [01:05:00] actually increasing the resource and power within our communities to be able to, um, have more influence on our line of sight on our government agencies to help them make these changes because they're not easy changes for institutions to make. And we can if we pretend that they are. I fear that we risk having this conversation again in 10 years because people say that they're gonna [01:05:30] do it and they may have the right intention. But it just doesn't bed in, and we have to create systems to make sure that we're constantly hearing when it's not happening. Just to say I don't think that that's a completely fair characterization of the police. There are some and in fact, most police officers are are incredibly [01:06:00] good servants in our community who do really good work to keep us safe. And I think there would have been something powerful about having police in uniform marching in the pride parade. Actually, I think that sends an important signal, uh, both to those wishing to join the police, Uh, and to others A about the fact that the police officers do align with all communities, saying that I, I always think that there is more that we can do to ensure that officers [01:06:30] coming through have the training they need to deal with the situations they will face in the most effective and compassionate manner. Mhm. We have a II. I really love our criminal justice policy. And that's that's about, um, reducing, reducing over policing basically and reducing prison populations. But this is my, um, my personal view. Um, I recently learned about the I think [01:07:00] it's called the Freedom House Ambulance, which is the the the first paramedics, um, were, um, African American men. And they were, um, before before they existed. If you were in the States and you had a medical emergency, The police would come, Um, and, uh, either the police or, um uh, a funeral home because they were the people who could take stretches, which is really bizarre. And then this new profession was invented. I promise. This has a point that gets to that, gets [01:07:30] your question. A new profession was invented, which was paramedics who could come and actually help people and particularly for African American communities. That was incredibly important because they didn't want the same people who had been arresting them and beating them up one day to come and help them if they're having a heart attack the next day. So what I'm getting to is I feel like that there is a new profession that we need, Um, that hasn't Maybe it hasn't been invented yet. That's not the ambulance. And it's not the police, but it's people who are there to to help people who [01:08:00] are possibly having, um, mental health issues. Or there's some kind of, um, non violent incident going on that normally we would send the police to, but the police are just not the right people to do it, and I think they've shown in a lot of cases they can't be trusted and are not the right people to attend. These sorts of events just like to support um, Jan's, uh, comments about [01:08:30] the things that, um, parliamentarians can do to, um, make sure that the police are, um, held to account and practising in a way that is appropriate through, uh, data. And, um, to hold them account to data. Um, that's collected. That is accurate about, um, systemic bias in policing. And secondly, ensure that that is part of, um of training. I think the, um and also yes, I did mention the police, Um uh, diversity [01:09:00] liaison officers. They are part of the solution which Jan mentions also included, um, engagement with community. And actually that not being something that's done once but is an ongoing, um, thing, because that's how trusting relationships can be built and sustained. I mean, I think the the thing that I find tricky about, um, about where about pride is just that, um, there are, um, uh, queer police officers doing, um, you know, being part [01:09:30] of the positive change we want to see and I, I want them to feel um, like they can be, um, uh, proud of who, Who they are and the really important role they're having in transforming forming the police. However, um, I also think that there are times when there are, uh, when it is, um, very difficult Between our community and the police and the right, um, decision at one moment might have been to set a laid out that that that probably was [01:10:00] the right decision. But, um uh, in the long term, we have to get to a place where we have a, um a police service that, uh um com minority communities, um, Rainbow community And, um uh, and, um, uh, black and brown members of our community feel safe with an important time to think about how you're voting on the cannabis referendum, because obviously these issues are very pertinent to that as well. [01:10:30] Thank you so much for that. Um, we've come to the end now, so I just want to thank all of you all the way from Kalla representing the top party. Um, Miss Jessica Hamon. Thank you so much. She has answered the questions tonight to Rainbow Affairs and also has answered a lot of questions regarding the covid tracing app. Thank you. Um, [01:11:00] the train might have stopped her tonight, but she's here, OK? Being the integrity of representing integrity in New Zealand. Well, right, thank you is the lead. Nicola will. Thank you so much. Thank you so much for being welcome. Um, if you have any questions, [01:11:30] um, for, um, representatives, uh, after this as well, please feel free. Um, we just end with Thank you. Thank you. OK.
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