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Uh, my name is Simon. Jen. And I was the, um, CN intern here, uh, last year and I curated sleeping arrangements as part of my internship. Um, and this event kind of jumps off some of the themes of the show. The show brings together four artists from three generations, all of whom were impacted differently, um, to different degrees in different ways by the HIV and AIDS crisis in the early 19 nineties. Um, and this kind of expands on [00:00:30] some of the themes, Um, and in particular, looks at the creative responses to the crisis in particular, um, the AIDS. Um, So we've got three speakers here today, So, um Richard Bang, um, Kevin Jensen and Julia Craig, and I'll introduce them in a little more detail. Um, in a second. Um, but I also want to introduce, uh, our friends from the New Zealand AIDS Foundation as well. So, um, we've invited me here today basically to acknowledge that the crisis isn't over and that we're talking about the history of HIV [00:01:00] and a I in New Zealand. But, um, it's very much, uh, a real life really existing thing. Um, happening now. Um, So I just want to thank them for the work that they've done over the past 30 years in terms of advocacy and support, um, and outreach and also acknowledge some of their recent, um, successes, which I thought I would remember. But I'm gonna have to read, um, So they recently, um, successfully advocated for the removal of CD four thresholds, which means it's, um, much easier for HIV positive people to access medicines earlier. Now, [00:01:30] um, they've also advocated for the approval of, um, prep in New Zealand. Um, it's widely available now, um, and they're also highlighting, um, undetectable viable loads, which, um, is an attempt to reduce stigma around positive people. Um, and encourage, um, prevention as well. Um, so they're available for informal conversation after the talk is over. Um, and I also want to thank them again for being here, And we've also got, um, Gareth Watkins here from Pride and Z, and he's gonna be recording the talk. Um, and [00:02:00] I'd all encourage you to check out the pride NZ website. Um, after the talk is over, it's an incredible resource with an incredible archive of, um, queer stories from a and I'm really grateful for the work that Gareth has done. So thank you for being here. Um, I'll now just introduce our three speakers. And then after that, they will, um, talk for about five minutes each about the work that they've done, Um, and why they're here. Um, and then I'll ask a few questions, and then I'll open it out to the audience for you to ask questions as well. So, uh, first up is Richard Bang. Um, So between 1991 [00:02:30] and 1993 Richard worked at the AIDS prevention events team operating out of the New Zealand AIDS Foundation, Um, a centre in Wellington. Uh, during this time, he was part of the unveiling of the New Zealand New Zealand AIDS Memorial Quilt in Wellington in 1993. And since then, uh, Richard has worked as an independent events and communications specialist and as cultural specialist for the US Embassy in Wellington, and he's currently executive director of Arts Access, which is an NGO, um, nationally recognised as the advocate for accessibility [00:03:00] and inclusion and arts and culture for all people in a, um, Julia Craig is currently undertaking her master's in art history at the University of Auckland researching artistic production around AIDS and HIV. Um, she's a curator at Window Gallery as well, um, and has held positions at Artist Alliance New Zealand at Venice and connect the dots. Um Charitable Trust. Kevin Jensen has been involved in the Nelson HIV AIDS Support Network since the early 19 nineties. And, [00:03:30] um, the New Zealand AIDS quilt. Um, since late 1994 in 2012, he assisted the Museum of New Zealand to papa, um, assessing of the quilts into their collection and now maintains the quilts website as a document, um, a living document of the quilt. Um, and he was also recognised in 2005 by the New Zealand AIDS Foundation for his work and was given a lifetime membership of the foundation. Um, I'll make a start with, uh as I always [00:04:00] do when I address any group. Um, it's normally school Children. Secondary school Children are the most of that I've addressed with the difference between HIV and A. I DS. They're often referred to in the one breath as being the same. They're not. HIV is a virus which depletes the immune system of the body when the immune system gets sufficiently low. There are 26 particular [00:04:30] illnesses the opportunistic illnesses which, when they become established in the body, are very, very hard to treat. Once you get two of these illnesses and you have HIV, you are said to have a DS. The United States goes one further and says, once your, um, CD four cell count, which is your white cell count for [00:05:00] the immune system goes below 200. That becomes age defining as well. The Americans are the only ones that do that. Um, early on in the in the pandemic, once someone died of, uh, what generally becomes known as dying of AIDS. It was instant cremation. Body was cremated within 24 hours of death maximum, no time [00:05:30] for funeral. Nothing Health department were there, took the body cremated and then the following day handed back the ashes. So there's a lot of, um, emotional problems arose there around grieving in the mid 19 eighties. Now that business with instant cremation is worldwide practise. It still happens here in New Zealand today, but not very [00:06:00] often. Thankfully, New Zealand was the very first country in the world that stopped that practise and treated someone who died with, uh, someone who had AIDS who died. They were not cremated. They were treated as an ordinary, everyday death. Um, that is now gradually spreading throughout the world. The the 1st 10 that died in New Zealand were automatic cremations. From then on, it wasn't. [00:06:30] The difference is if the words HIV or a I DS appears on the death certificate. It is instant cremation if they do not appear on the death certificate that treated as an ordinary death. Now with that, in the 19 eighties mid 19 eighties, there was an American known as Cleve Jones, who was having a lot of trouble dealing with the come to terms with the loss of his partner. And [00:07:00] he basically the story that I was told by someone who had had a lot to do with him. Was he basically one day he got a length of material, take it to the fence, attacked it with some spray cans of paint, and he started feeling to take out of this frustration and everything and started feeling so much better for it. And from that it grew into the quilts, Um, or the names project, as it's known as in the United States. [00:07:30] UM, it was launched in June 1987 with its very first display, with 40 panels on display. Four months later, there's a display outside the White House in Washington DC, with 1920 panels on display. Now each of those white rectangles on that screen is made up of four blocks. [00:08:00] Now the panels are 6 ft by three, the international standard grave plot size. Because of the instant cremation for the vast majority of people, those are the nearest you'll ever get to a grave for them. With the they've joined together into, uh, Block, eight of them joined to make a block. Four blocks, joined together, created one of those rectangles. This is from another display [00:08:30] where the white there's actually a white walkway between them. In the early I think it was 1992 93. There was an a display in Washington DC again. It was the last big full display of the American Quilt, which is based in San Francisco. It took 17 full trains to take the quilt to Washington DC because of the size of it [00:09:00] It's huge. They had people reading the names 24 hours a day. It took 3.5 days. The, uh, there are 42 countries in the world that have a quilt project. The Australian one is the largest one in the world outside the United States. It is now housed in the Powerhouse Museum in Sydney. Um, it was first [00:09:30] displayed on World AIDS Day, the first of December 1988. It had 35 panels. It's now, I think, from memory, something like 100 and something blocks. The New Zealand quilt is made up of 100 and eight single and two double panels, which have been sewn together and forms 16 blocks. There are also 12 other individual panels. The very first panel [00:10:00] for um, New Zealand. That is the very first, uh, panel that was made for the New Zealand quilt for Peter in December 1988. On the fifth of October 1991 the first New Zealand unfolding of the quilt took place in the Auckland Art Gallery. There were 32 panels, and that was unfolded in the presence of the Governor General at the time, Dame Catherine [00:10:30] Taz There is and also, um, the convenor of the Australian quilt who actually brought several blocks of the Australian quilt over with her. Then in 2010, I created the, um, the quilt website. And as as, uh, Simon mentioned as a living ongoing memorial for it because, [00:11:00] um, it is deteriorating because of all the mount masses of folding and unfolding and places that's been put onto onto grass onto concrete and dirty floors. You name it. It's just about being there. And so it's not good for the preservation of a of a quilt. So they've, uh uh, Michael Bancroft got to and negotiated with Papa. [00:11:30] And between the two of us, Michael and I, we got the quilts and all the documentation associated with it ready for presentation to Papa six years ago this month on the third of May 2012, it was presented to te papa, and it's now lodged in te papa for safekeeping and with, uh, displays when, uh, space and their display programme permits [00:12:00] been used. The quilts have actually been used as models for various other uh, things around the world, as well as different illnesses. and that, like for American armed forces killed in the Iraqi war and various things like that, now there's a couple of them in particular I'd like to mention, um, if you could go back to that one. That is the what's known as the block of the New Zealand quilt. It's block [00:12:30] number seven. The quilt was taken at the time, was taken on a tour of Northland, and while they were on the they actually got together and they sewed the panels together to form that block. There's one in particular, up on the very top, right? I think, for Ian. When they were doing it, they looked at. They saw the [00:13:00] initials, the letter and down the left hand side of it. And the people said, What's that? This is family whose panel is next to them and want to know the significance of the letters ins and ends into genealogy. And those are the initials of his ancestors going back generation by generation. And it turned out that when they very first settled in Northland, Ian's family purchased land [00:13:30] from family, brought the two families together again over 100 years later. Next one, please John's one. Now, this is one. I've had a lot of my, um, involvement in the making of it. Um, John's father came to me one day with the support network. His son John had died in England [00:14:00] and that, and, um, we ended up to cut a long story short. The support network got together and help Roy make a panel for John, which was presented to the quilt in 1999. The It tells that, like most of the panels, they do tell a story, um, or have some aspect of his life. He was born in Nelson, raised in Auckland, loved travelling the world, died in England. [00:14:30] He he was a very keen gardener. Subsequently, the you've got the and the English Rose, he liked origami. There is actually an origami, um, bird on there, and it does actually open out as it's unfolded. Um, it was also indicate this growing the same as his father is in the parties. And also which is [00:15:00] recognise it by the wine glass and great with the music. With the the wine glass, there's one corner at the bottom left hand corner that just wouldn't stay put. So the person whose house that we were in having a working bee and going to the next one. There we are. Yes, I do look a lot younger there. Me on the very right, Um, and the the chap in the blue shirt in the middle there is Roy. That is, um, John's [00:15:30] father. Shortly after that photo was taken, the person who owned his house we were in Who's got a head down there? She, um, said, I know what to do. We'll get some super glue. Forget all about the fact that this material and super glue goes straight through. Material went to lift it off. We took a heap of varnish off the oak table with us. [00:16:00] That bit of varnish is still there. That panel has not been incorporated into one of the blocks yet. It's one of the 12 loose panels. Um, going to the next one in in, uh, you might have heard of well, be S the famous these, uh, great artist. He created this for his first lover. Some of the things that are and [00:16:30] it they it's on Calico. There's some of the paintings and that in the corners are oil. And that so things crack specifically done. So things will crack with time and that and memories do fade. But at the same time, his image is actually done in coffee. So in photos and coffee so that, uh, it gives a softer texture and it will not crack or diminish over time. [00:17:00] There's also a bit of the old farm to play around, framing it and off the tractor and the bits of his old works, and that now there's the next one 1994 for World AIDS Day. The panel, the committee that looked after the quilt, had the problem. Well, just who does it do we know who died of AIDS? And so they [00:17:30] created this block. There is a whole block, 12 ft by 12 ft, specifically mentioning people from around the world who have died as a result of AIDS or HIV infection. Um, and people like the photographer Richard Maplethorpe, the um, ballerina or ballet dancer, not a ballerina, ballet dancer. Rudolph No, um, various actors, film director Eric Jarman, and that there's [00:18:00] activists there. Musicians, Liberace is there, all mentioned on the and there are blank one bits here for people to be added later, another one panel for Roger Wright. The background of that was actually made up of the seats of the backside of Pierce of Roger's jeans. Roger was the one of the people instrumental for [00:18:30] introducing a needle exchange scheme into New Zealand for reducing um harm for harm reduction amongst the needle injecting drug users in the country. Next one. A couple, John and Rudy. John is a New Zealander. Rudy was a Dutchman who settled in New Zealand. People who make that is the two panels joined together to make it a double panel After, [00:19:00] um, they died. The people who made the um, the panels actually made another one of Rudy's side and sent it to Rudy's parents. And it's now on Block 10 of the Dutch quilt. Um, those of you who have seen the exhibition upstairs will have seen the the panel there. Uh, for [00:19:30] Simon, it's an oversized panel. And if we could jump to the next one, please. That is the version that appears on the New Zealand quilt. The panel upstairs. It's got the outline of the figures outlined in red. There, they're not at a and the also you would have noticed to the upstairs The, [00:20:00] um the poem on the wall by initially meant, uh, spoken or spoken by Brenton Pole. So if we can have the next one Thank you. That is Brendan's panel on the New Zealand quilt made by his sister. Thank you so much. Kevin. Um, should we move on to Richard now? Uh, thank you very much for the introduction. And, [00:20:30] uh, Kevin, it's an honour to be following you. Um, from what you've done, I need to start, uh, my part of today honouring the lovers who I lost who don't have quilts. 11 has a quilt. Um, so I'd like to remember Ian Smith and [00:21:00] Lee Rans Field and Justin Smith and my beloved Keith Grey, who before he got sick, took me to the airport in London and said, You've learned everything you need to learn and the UK now go back to Australia and New Zealand and go to university and be a teacher [00:21:30] and do everything that you need to do. So when I look at the quilts, Kevin, I remember those beloved men. And then I had the opportunity of coming to Wellington and working for the AIDS Foundation in 1991. Hm. And I've got friends in the audience now who remember the days when we didn't know what hit [00:22:00] us, as Kevin is referring to. We didn't know who was going to die next. We didn't know who was sick next. There was a very strong sense of urgency, emergency guilt, shame, fear, shock loss and grief and no support [00:22:30] from the national context. The government, sort of at that stage, didn't know what the heck was going on. The the were dying, and that's sort of OK. They can. They can handle that. There's a problem anyway. Too much sex, whatever they're doing. And what happens internationally is that when terrible things happen to people like when tragedy happens in communities, people [00:23:00] get together. When there's no cure, when there's no answers and there's nothing else to do, you hold on to one another, and it creates groupings and holdings and doings. People start to do stuff. And so when the quilt the first quilt was made, which Kevin referred to, [00:23:30] was an expression of loss and grief, but above all, the need to remember that his lover ever lived because if his body's been taken away and cremated within minutes. What do you do with that? You have to have something to hold [00:24:00] on to. So I'm internally grateful to the first quilt maker and all the coordinators like you who've gone forward at a time when there was not the wonderful retroviral drugs that we have now. And the campaigns and the ability to be, uh, non transmit you you don't transmit anymore. You can't get it if you haven't got it. All that sort of stuff. In the days [00:24:30] when this was going on, people didn't know if you could catch HIV by sitting on the same toilet or living together or kissing or whatever. So it's interesting that in history, quilting has been about storytelling and about recalling so we don't forget. And quilts in America and other countries are I'm sure [00:25:00] you'll talk about this. Um, Julia, um are about heirlooms my own. In my own family. My daughter has the most beautiful quilt that was made by her godmother, and it something that I treasure forever, because it's to do with the heritage of the family. The significant thing that Kevin also mentioned is that a quilt in the [00:25:30] names project or the New Zealand Quilt Project is the size of a grave. But a quilt is something you put on a bed, so you get two things with the AIDS quilt project. You get the finality of death but the cosiness of sleep. So that's how we can get to work on it together. Working bees [00:26:00] would get together and families and friends would come together often people that didn't know one another, Parents would suddenly meet all the friends of a man or woman who died of AIDS in New Zealand and get together and start sowing. A lot of people didn't know how to sew, so they glued or they used paint or they used clips or whatever, and a lot of healing was done through [00:26:30] the forming of a quilt. So in each quilt, in preserving the name of someone who's lost becomes a story of togetherness and healing and moving forward. So the AIDS projects do a lot, did a lot and still do do a lot for healing. And the work of the quilt [00:27:00] when it was shown in New Zealand was a very effective HIV and AIDS awareness project. So not only was it the putting to bed, the burial, the grief space. But then it had work to do. And Kevin, you were one of the people that made sure it did its work so that our men [00:27:30] and women who had lost became part of creating the future. So I was in Wellington in 19. Whenever I can't even remember when it was actually when Simon rang me and said, Could you do this? I thought, I'm not gonna remember a thing here, so I had to dig them into my memory. And our friend Peter in Sydney has sent us some images of what happened in Wellington. So this is an unveiling of a quilt, Uh, when it visits a city or a town and it has a whole lot of protocol and ceremony [00:28:00] around it, because rightfully so, we are honouring our departed, and we each time the quilt gets opened it, we reawaken them. So in our, uh, for our you don't just walk into a graveyard and start to thump around you gently wake up the memory and you honour the people who've died. And so each quilt would be brought into a room folded up placed into the space, and the unveil [00:28:30] would then have a job of working around and opening it up. And then there's this moment of this wonderful moment when it's lifted up into a mushroom and then it comes down onto the ground. It's like life memory all at once. It's the most amazing freeing of the fabric and the stories within it. And they the the unveil is. Then, while they're lifting it up, they also turn so it turns in a circle, [00:29:00] and then it lands back on the ground. Each one is treated the same way. So in the was in the mall, in Washington or around New Zealand, the the the protocol of the How the quilt is approached and unveiled is treated the same way. And when it's finished with, I think it's folded up again so you can see that, and this is in the Michael Fowler Centre. You can probably recognise it from that wonderful 19 [00:29:30] seventies floor. It's still there, and these are images from quilts that from that period from that day. So, um, thank you very much for inviting me to talk about that. That's, um, pretty amazing. I haven't talked about this for 30 years, actually, because you get burnt out and you close it down and you walk away and you forget or you don't. And then you get asked to talk about [00:30:00] it. So pretty amazing, Simon. Thank you very much. Thank you very much, Richard. Well, I'll pass over to Julia. Um, my name is Julia. I am, um, as Simon said, one of the curators at window up in Auckland. So I'm Auckland based. And, um, I will also work for Artists Alliance, which is an advocacy group for artists, Um, visual [00:30:30] artists, um, nationwide. And, um, I'm also currently writing my master's thesis, looking at artistic responses to HIV and a I DS, um I come to, uh, researching HIV and AIDS as an outsider. A relative outsider. I, um, am not personally affected by HIV and AIDS, but, um, I feel very, very privileged to be able to research. Um, the subject matter, Um you might wonder why I come [00:31:00] to HIV and AIDS. Um, I think, uh, my interest, uh, or the effect it has on me came from, uh, first, uh, in undergrad. I remember doing sexual histories. Um, at Auckland University, which is very, um, one of the best papers I've ever taken. And for that, we watched the documentary How to Survive a Plague. Um, and I was really, um, affected by the story of Act up New York, Um, and the activations that they did in the eighties [00:31:30] and nineties. Um, and then recently, uh, about a year ago, um, I lost my father to terminal illness. And, um, I really, um, remembered that feeling the the profound apathy that I experienced, um, from people around me. And it really reminded me of, um, how to survive a plague and that profound apathy that I think people living with HIV and AIDS experienced. And no way did I experience the same level. [00:32:00] But I just felt a real connection to those stories and the outrage that I felt from the apathy that I felt and I was like that could be nothing compared to what, um happened during the eighties and nineties, um, with HIV and AIDS. So I felt I really wanted to do a deep dive into that kind of research, and I it felt really pertinent as well, because I noticed recently, there's been um, a huge boom in curatorial [00:32:30] practise internationally revisiting, um, HIV and a ID. Um, in America, there's been, um, quite a few significant, uh, retrospective and large survey exhibitions, um, of HIV and AIDS. In artistic practise. One big one is art aids America. That was a travelling exhibition two years ago around America. There's also been some in the UK and Europe, and also some kind of recurs here in New Zealand with, um, uh, implicated [00:33:00] an immune which was at, um, restaged or recreated at my and now we're sleeping arrangements. So there was this really interesting kind of revisit of artistic practise around HIV and AIDS. And this also coincided with, of course, um uh, 2015 New Zealand AIDS Foundation. Um uh, showed us all that HIV and AIDS is at it. Well, HIV, um, transmissions are currently at its highest in New Zealand, [00:33:30] so it's very clear that this, uh, issue is not historic size. It's very urgent and really important. So I considered that in the wake of this happening in New Zealand and abroad, uh, representation is really important. Um and so I'm interested in how artists, um can use their art to counter the binaries that have come out of misrepresentations [00:34:00] through the media, surrounding people and what it is to live with. HIV Um, when I tell people what um, I'm studying and what my thesis about you can immediately tell there's confusion around. There's still confusion around the difference between HIV and AIDS. Um, and also people are still unclear in, um, how it's transmitted. Um, so it's really obvious that it's a really important issue and that it needs There needs to be a great discourse around [00:34:30] it, and I think artists can be one of the biggest players in this issue. So, um, the structure of my thesis is basically looking at, um, media representations of people living with HIV in the eighties and nineties and the kind of stereotypes and binaries that emerged from that. Which is people living with HIV as patients or as victims, uh, social and sexual deviance, which of course, [00:35:00] is not true. And also, um, H I person with HIV as male homosexual, um, middle class Caucasian, which is also, um, uh, not particularly true for New York. For example, New York In the eighties and nineties, women of colour were hugely overrepresented in as, uh, HIV patients. Um, so and then my thesis will look at how artists kind of circumvent or [00:35:30] open up those binaries and offer counter narratives or possibilities of what it means to live with HIV. And hopefully, um, inspire awareness and empathy and multitudes of what it means to live with HIV rather than a un visualising. Um, kind of one story of what it is to live with HIV because I don't think one story is the same. And it's, um, fluid [00:36:00] and open and always kind of changing. And every I know from my grief, my grief looks so different to everyone else's, and it's not all the same. But I also think that looking at the past looking at the eighties and nineties is really important to understand the present, Um, because past and present live at the same time, like that idea of that the past, present and future all is happening and unfolding at the same time. And just like our previous losses and [00:36:30] grief lives with us and we carry it with us and it exists with us, so yeah. Thank you. Um, I just have a few questions for each of you. If, um, I mean to start with, uh, Richard and Kevin. I'm interested in how you both got involved with the quilt project. Um, and how you first heard about it. Um well, I first became involved with it through the Nelson HIV AIDS support [00:37:00] network. Um, when we because we were being in the support network, we were actually looked at as being a branch of the AIDS Foundation. Back in those days, there was no individual membership of the foundation. You can only belong to the foundation as a branch. And yep, And the we were notified about the quilt and that through the foundation. And you do not be having to have [00:37:30] the annual leave at the time that the quilt was going to make an appearance in Nelson and yeah, just sort of went from there. And how did you encourage people who maybe weren't so artistically inclined to get involved? Good question. I don't know. You know, not being artistically inclined myself. It's very hard to answer that one. [00:38:00] I know with Roy, as I mentioned before there with the making of his panel for John, Um, I mentioned that I told him that the quilt existed, Um, and told him a bit about the quilt. Would he be interested in having a panel made for John and that with you? So, um, from the, um, support network helping him in that and he said, yes, he'd love to. And it grew from [00:38:30] there. And in fact, I still am in contact with Roy. I only saw him a couple of months ago, and he still remembers the making of that panel. And with the glueing of it to the table and who were some of the other key players in the, um, the quilt project at the time? Um, early on, uh, when I first became involved with it, when it first came to Nelson. Uh, Nicky Eddy was the, um, the convenor of the project [00:39:00] based in Auckland and before the first unveiling were unfolding in the Auckland Art Gallery. And, um 1991 the final sort of stitching together of the blocks and everything like that happened in her place. There are photographs of that, um, and the unfolding and everything on the website, which, by the way, is, um, aids or AIDS. quilt dot org dot NZ [00:39:30] and the protocols that, um, Richard mentioned about the unfolding and everything like that. They're all listed there as well. Um, yes. Nicky had a lot to do with Nicky. Um, I did meet um, Jean Stewart, her predecessor as the national convenor, and also had a lot to do with, um, Denis Moran, who took over from, uh, Nicky. And he was the one who brought the quilt to Nelson [00:40:00] for the National unfolding in 1999. And you try finding a place big enough to unfold 16 blocks of that size. That's not easy. And I've toured around schools and that on my own. But we know we've toured around schools. We've normally only taken about eight or nine blocks of the time. It's, um that more than fills an assembly hall. Uh, Julie, you spoke about this, [00:40:30] uh, resurgence of interest in the in the eighties and nineties and the, um, activism and discourse around HIV and AIDS. I wonder if you have any thoughts as to, um, Why now? Why might it be of interest now? Um, I think so. Ted, He's a, um, American curator and writer who talks a lot about this. And he, um, divides, um, the kind of story of HIV and a I DS into kind of the AIDS crisis, which [00:41:00] was that first decade. Um, And then, um, sees it as kind of over in 1996 in a mainstream point of view, um, and which I think he calls the silence or something like that. And then now he sees he identifies, and he calls it the AIDS crisis Revisit, which is happening now. And I think he, um, cites that as, um, there's lots of anniversaries coming up. So 2016, 20 years since anti successful antiretroviral [00:41:30] drugs were introduced. So lots of anniversaries coming up. I think some up, um, anniversary recently, So people are kind of looking back, and they're reminded of it. They're forced to be reminded of it, and so they want to kind of take stock of where they are now and where we have come, and also what needs to still happen. Um, because it should There should not be a silence over [00:42:00] it because it is still unfolding, especially in New Zealand. We have, um, still issues to confront, and, um, also the, um I've noticed the media here in New Zealand, even though very small on a small scale, you can already kind of cringe at what they're about. What people are saying. Um I think last year, the, um, pride parade, um, [00:42:30] crowned, uh, Mr Gay New Zealand. And he had talked about how he had unprotected sex with his partner while being HIV positive. But he had an undetectable file load, and his partner was also HIV positive. But there was still a huge a huge relative, kind of large outcry saying that he should be stripped of his title of Mr Gay New Zealand. But, um, he had an undetectable fire upload, and his partner was also HIV [00:43:00] um, positive. So there was no harm, no risk at all and having, um, unprotected sex. But still, the media grabbed on to it and kind of wanted to make a bit of a over it. So I think there's still, um, issues that we need to work out with, how people are being represented and how, um, the knowledge about HIV is being used and what people know. So I think that's why there's this this curatorial interest and artistic [00:43:30] interest in revisiting because it's I think it's decidedly not over completely. Yeah, um, so you're writing about, uh, four artists in your thesis, and, um, those artists are working at different points over 30 years. I wonder, um, can you talk a little more about the specific artists? And also whether you've noticed a change in approach, um, and output over the over the time. Um, so, of course, I am looking at Felix Gonzalez tores, um, looking at his billboard project in [00:44:00] Manhattan when he took a photo of his empty bed after his lover Ross had passed away and he took this black and white photo of any of their empty bed and put 24 billboards, I think all around Manhattan kind of unexplained. Um, and he's kind of injecting something that's very personal, very private into the public sphere. And, um, bringing something that should be hidden. Um, like, queer desire, queer sexual [00:44:30] sexuality, um, and loss and HIV into the public. Um, and then I'm also looking at Lyle Ashton Harris. Um, I saw his work last year at the Whitney Biennial. He did this thing called Chrome Archive and he unearthed um hundreds and hundreds of old personal photographs and displayed it in the Whitney Biennial. And it's, um, it's overview of his whole life and his relationships with his friends, [00:45:00] um, and lovers and family. And it includes big, um, political events. Um, like some protests and a huge conventions, Um, and also some really intimate photographs of his friends, um, taking anti viral drugs and who, um, and himself with his lovers. And it wasn't overtly about HIV, but you knew it was it was implicit. And I liked how it was this [00:45:30] overview of his whole life. And it wasn't looking at HIV in a vacuum. It was, um it showed his vitality and agency, his friends and lovers and these whole networks of people and communities that kind of grow around, um, loss and grief. And, um then I'm also looking at Kiki Smith, who's, um, a New York artist again. Her sister died of HIV, and she I'm looking specifically at Red Spill, which is this beautiful, huge [00:46:00] work of, um, glass, huge glass blood cells on a floor. And so she's making something that's seen as infectious, um, and dirty and making it precious and big and large scale and glass and monumental. Um, And then finally, I'm looking at Ron and his, um uh, performances using his body, um, specifically, um, increible flesh in which he [00:46:30] lay himself, um, in the middle of a gallery, um, and pinned back his eyes and eyelids with thread. And, um, he lay naked on, um, a metal table. And he invited, um audience to care for him and, uh, rub Vaseline on him where he was, um, bleeding and sore and shaved. And he did that for six hours. So he was for kind of forcing [00:47:00] the audience to care for him. Um, and the implication is that he's HIV positive. Um, but he's, uh, engaging in B DS M, uh, kind of sexuality while he's lying there. And while you're caring for him. So his sexuality is very overt and, um, present and celebrated. But also it's durational, and it's painful, and it's it's forcing us to take care of him. And, um, he's really [00:47:30] owning his relationship with the caregiver. Um, and taking charge of it, which is really important in HIV is this caregiving aspect. Um, yeah, What's the other half of your question? Um I was wondering if you noticed sort of a change in approach to how artists approach the topic over the time. Um uh, those artists are, um obviously Felix Gonza has passed away, but the rest are still, um, alive. [00:48:00] Now. They were all working around the same time in the nineties. Um, but I've noticed that, um, uh, I went to recently last year aids at home, which was an exhibition in New York. And it looked at artists working in the context of the domestic. And there was one artist who is, um, a young artist who I really, um, uh, really loved. And her name was Kia LA. And she's HIV positive she was born HIV positive because [00:48:30] her mother, um, was it and transmitted through breastfeeding. Um, and she, um, always talks about how her story is very much, um, not heard and is never spoken of in HIV context, that being transmitted through breastfeeding. Um, and she's, um, homosexual woman. And she's, um, mother of the house of which is a vogue house in, [00:49:00] um, New York. And she uses her, um, body and movement and voguing, um, to express her her story. And I um, I think she's also uses her own photography. And, um, I think the artist. Now I notice they always throwing back to the nineties. She's always throwing back to her mother and her mother's activism and her art. So I think this [00:49:30] past and present is always wrapped up in contemporary artists. And I think you can see that in Langdon Pole and Michael McCabe as well that, um, I think that's a huge, interesting thing that's happening in this like relationship to time and, um unfolding. And never that no one ever wants to universalize HIV. They're not saying this is what it's like. [00:50:00] They're just offering up one narrative, which I think is really interesting. Um, I read it in Julia's writing. She writes, um, that art can kind of help expand our understanding of what families mean and what caring means. Um, and Kevin, I'm just wondering if, um, have you found that in your work with the quilt? Um, yes, there's a lot of, um, love and that comes through and the caring and that, um, [00:50:30] there's one case in particular that comes to mind, too. Um, not directly so for the family. But one of the secondary schools I was at, um we had the we had some blocks out on the floor and that and we it was open for the students and they had to come through during the interval. And that and the teachers and that, too, And to just come and have a look. And there's this group [00:51:00] of senior girls came in and one of the teachers happened to be there. And it was shortly after the, um after the change of regime in Romania. There was a lot of orphans who had HIV and AIDS, and they were just basically locked up and forgotten about. And she went over there as a volunteer to work with these, uh, these AIDS orphans and that and she [00:51:30] started. She opened up. She started talking to the senior girls and that about what it was like looking after them and everything. And how girls, the same age as the students were going out at night and prostituting themselves and that. And just as it turned out, there was they were all late getting back to class. The whole lot of them, Um and we must have gone through over a box of tissues for the talking and that. And it was the first [00:52:00] time. It was about seven or eight years after the event. It was the first time she had ever been able to talk about the time that she spent in Romania looking after these Children at a very, very emotional time. Yes. As can be very, very powerful in that respect, um, and the care and everything that goes on it comes through not directly through the families, because I've had very little with the [00:52:30] families other than with Roy. Um, yeah. And we had a lot a lot of laughed and putting his panel together. And also, there were sad times in that as well. I mean, the way that, um, Roy found out about, uh, John's passing and everything like that. Yeah. And I just have one final question before we open it up for the, um, audience. Um, why do you think, um, the quilt remains so important and so significant. [00:53:00] Um, probably because it's the, um it is the, uh, the memorial for a lot of people. It's only about a quarter of the people who have died in New Zealand are remembered on the New Zealand quilt. And yeah, it's unfortunately, we can't sort of keep it in the everyone's sort of face all the time because of the, um, deterioration of it. But also, [00:53:30] it hasn't been added to for years now. It was, as I say, it was, uh, six years ago, it was lodged with the Papa at that stage. It had been over 10 years since the previous panel had been the last panel had been presented to the quilt. A lot of it has come about with the, um, in the mid 19 nineties with the development of the pro inhibitors was, um it was an interesting one that the drug trials [00:54:00] in the States Normally, they've got to have a year long drug, uh, go through different stages of trials in the last stage is usually for about a year. And with a large pop, uh, population base, um, that one there, about half way through the FDA Food and Drug Administration in America stepped in and told them to stop the trial. They immediately approved it. Pharmac, or predecessor of what's now known as pharmac, [00:54:30] moved probably the fastest I've ever moved in their life within a fortnight. They've proved it for you here in New Zealand, fully funded. In doing so, it reduced the death rate in New Zealand from one every six days for about one every three years. It turned the illness from a guaranteed death sentence within a year to a long term manageable illness. [00:55:00] Um, because of that, we haven't had the, uh, so many presented and it tends to sort of start to go into everyone's background. They start to lose touch with the fact that it was there. And Julie, I wonder if you have any thoughts about why it remains so important and significant. Um, I think the the quilt and all the different iterations around the world of the quilt just symbolises so much. Um, quilt making, [00:55:30] I think, is, um powerful and how it's often collaborative. Um, it's durational. So therefore it's therapeutic. Um, there's the something therapeutic about together working on this thing for someone. Um, I, um, considered starting a quilt for my dad when he passed away. But I I tried to attempt it. It just seemed too hard. So I think I need like, a team around me to help, but I I felt [00:56:00] that need I wanted to like, um, make something. It's a way of processing grief, I think. And I also find it really interesting. It's a it's traditionally a feminine craft that, um, uh, kind of has been harnessed by minority groups. Um, the quilt quilt making, I think, is a politicised act. It's not just HIV and AIDS that, um it's used for, uh, [00:56:30] a good example is Suzanne Lacy She made a work called the Crystal Quilt. Um, I think it was in the nineties and, um, she got, um, mo mobilised a huge community of, um, retired women. Um, and who, uh, maybe a forgotten part of society. Older women. And she brought them together. And they all collaborated on this large, um, social action of making a quilt. And [00:57:00] I think, um, it just shows this craft object can be or this craft making can be used by communities and elevated in this really powerful way that I can't recall any other, um, medium, used like that is quite unique. Um, we're making, I think, because it's boundless and there's no rules and there's so many different techniques [00:57:30] that it becomes very, very personalised. and just the durational aspect. The therapy of working over something together with people using your hands is a really helpful tool to work through grief. I think so. The court is perfect for that. Yeah, Great. Thank you, everyone. Um, I wonder if anyone in the audience has any questions for our speakers. Um, it's really about the quilt and quilt making. There's a place in America called G, and, [00:58:00] um, during the Depression. Um, the women in jeans then began making quilts out of anything they could find, and they would always use something from somebody who would pass in in the quilt. And when you look at these quilts, they're made out of old jeans, which reminded me of, um, I can't remember his first name. His name was right that they make metal jeans or old sheets or bits of sacking or whatever, and they make these things, [00:58:30] and it's very involving with community. But it's also a necessity. And so there's a thing about quilt to say they are a necessity. They're not just something that is beautiful that you see in a craft show that costs a couple $100 and they are big business now as well. Um, and so the reason I'm pre this with that is because, um, that's great. [00:59:00] It's been so long, but, um, my closest friend when I was growing up, um, to a and his mother, Um, how did the parents of people with AIDS Group in New York City and, um, when she did Kenny's quilt, she sent me a piece of his shirt and [00:59:30] asked me if I would make a piece for his quilt. And, um, you can see with as a dog it is. You know, um, I always remember that material when I'm making quilts today for my grandchildren or my Children or friends or whatever I always remember can quilt. And, um and the colour of that shirt is in every single quilt I've made. So it [01:00:00] is very powerful thing to do. It's all right. Mhm else. Thank you. Sorry. I should arrange some tissues around the room. Uh, does anyone else have any questions I'd like to ask us. Um, I was really curious about the ritual. And how was the ritual? Who created the ritual And how was it? How we share? Actually, I, [01:00:30] um the very first documentation that I ever saw regarding the quilt and the unfolding series. It was there. Then, um, you basically the quilter is folded from the corner into the centre, then again, but the then to create a new square. Then the corners of that square are taken in again, and it goes down so that the quilt [01:01:00] is folded into a block about 3 ft square, and when it goes in, it is placed on the floor. Then the four people that carry it in on at each corner they get outreach and they grab their particular corner from the centre and bring it out. Then they move around to the next corner, move around in a clockwise direction, and then they reach and [01:01:30] bring out the next corner and move it around 9, 10, 9 times out of 10. The people who are doing the unfolding have never done it before, and the instructions are given as they go. Yeah, instructions as to what to do is done as they go. Um, as I say it is fully detailed as to how to do it on the website. So if I can add to that, um, it's like the unfolding of an origami [01:02:00] flower. The ceremonial components are walking, bending, opening, turning, lifting and letting go. So some fabulous group came up with that and they transferred it to New Zealand. And that's just what we I mean, I'm just listening to you, and that's what we did. And that's [01:02:30] a protocol that's so deeply ceremonial and loving and honouring and gentle at the same time. And it's all done with silence or perhaps a flute in the distance. Usually, there's a cut of welcoming all the quilts into the space and the spaces in Wellington that I'd like to let you know that the quilt went to in those days because you all walk through these places, so so that, you know, the quilt had that [01:03:00] ceremony, um, the part of the, uh, botanical gardens, where there is the sound shell on the lawn, the concourse of the Wellington Railway station underneath the big vault. So thousands of commuters had to go through it past it the old Manor Street mall before it got returned to being a street. It was all along there, [01:03:30] inside the Michael Fowler Centre and in the Westfield Mall, in amongst all the shoppers, and each place had the same ceremonial opening and the quilt was at its busiest and its most active in all those places, with people having to come across it. Once it was unveiled, then the the the random people that would come would come across it and they'd suddenly be in it. And it's [01:04:00] like like walking into a graveyard by accident or you walk into a space by accident. And so it became very, um, it did a lot of work. The quilt did a lot of good work, huge amount of work. Uh, usually in the schools. We didn't really have a lot of time to, um, prepare to do go through the unfolding and that with the students. We basically just had it sort of out ready for the first period of the class of the day [01:04:30] and they came in. They got the, um, and we spend a good hour with each class as they came through, doing the, um, the full safe sex message and everything as well. I think I've got time for a couple more questions. Um, if they are, I've actually got two, but someone else might have 11 of you, Simon? Um, the quote, Um, upstairs for Simon. Was he known to Was [01:05:00] it commissioned of Malcolm by, um, Tom and or a little bit more detail on that? I know that it was actually turned out to be the wrong size for the project. But what do you know about the relationship between those three men? Four men. Uh, so it was a man called Rob Colder. Who, um, commissioned the quilt. Who was a neighbour of Malcolm's, um, and involved in the sort of craft scene in Auckland in the eighties. Um, and [01:05:30] who also happened to be friends with, um, Terry Stringer, who's a sculptor, And Tim McConnell, Who's a composer, I believe. Um And so Rob commissioned it from Malcolm for, um, Simon, who was a mutual friend of theirs. Um, and, uh, it was the wrong size. So it was, um, politely rejected from the quilt. Um, and then it ended up with Tim and Terry. They weren't specific on the details, but I think, [01:06:00] um, I think it was possibly just too emotionally charged for Rob to keep. And so he gave it to his friends, OK, And and Richard did you, Um, Did you actually initiate kind of quilting bees stitching bees to make the work in Wellington? I do recall community arts going to one in someone's house. You couldn't stop people doing it, and people would just get together and there was no no problem because there was such a need. [01:06:30] So great moments would happen. Yes, There have been times in the office in Auckland, and they, um they've gone up. Got to work one day. And here's a package sitting on the doorstep opened up. And here's a quilt. No, not nothing attached to it. That was it. There are. There are there are two or three panels like that, their friends. But they are all made by friends, family and loved [01:07:00] ones of those who have been lost. And they were all made after death. Some urban did, um, Malcolm Harrison make a number of panels, you know, or was he involved with making um so it's just the one that I know about, um, for Simon Moley. Um, and I came across it by accident. Really? Mostly, um, I was just looking at the quilt, [01:07:30] and it's so distinctively Martin Harrison's style that it couldn't be anyone else, but it was. It was for Simon. Yeah. Yeah. So he basically remade the one upstairs in the correct dimensions. But I don't know if he helped anyone else or um was involved in any other way. I'm thinking it's quite possible that he came with me to the workshop. Well, in someone's house, it wasn't a workshop. It was just a bit a stitching beam in street. And And I remember cutting out a pair of scissors. So [01:08:00] does that ring a bell with you? Maybe just one more question here. Um, can you tell us a bit more about what kind of impact the group had on public awareness in New Zealand in the 19 nineties? Because people may be encountering more. For example, was there a great Yeah, I can get into that because that was my job. Um, we were really [01:08:30] understanding that we had to turn public opinion around two reasons why stop hating us? Stop fearing us and we needed to honour our own people. And so there's that going on. And at the same time, we wanted to use anything we could to get the health awareness message out there to stop people transmitting the disease. Unexpected unknowingly. So there were two [01:09:00] really big projects that happened. One was the international AIDS Candlelight memorial, which is worth an exhibition. If someone would like to do that, speak to me. I'm sitting on the stuff and the other was the names project and the New Zealand Quilt. So when the quilt came to Wellington for World AIDS day in 1990 was it one? I don't know. I'm sorry, but, um, we made sure that it got [01:09:30] on to television. Anything we did as queens, we really worked the media. We really anything that could get TV and newspaper and photographs we did. There was no Internet people. Can you imagine the world of no Internet? So television was everything. If you could get prime time, you did a huge amount of money. You get a lot of value for your awareness campaigns. So a lot of our thinking was around. How can we get this on TV or into the press? [01:10:00] Yes, we we use the, uh, the printed media a lot in Nelson with the, uh, the local paper and that the the weekly handout freebie papers and that and down the West coast and then L as well. It was good because a lot of this is so visual. So there there were a lot of images that, you know, the quilt candles, torches. It was all very visual. So it was good for that reason. It wasn't just blank pieces of paper. And also, it [01:10:30] really was probably the peak of a huge boom and quilting internationally. Really? Yeah, Well, so you had a whole extra kind of Can I just follow on from that too, because it strikes me. I was involved working at the arts Council in my eighties and nineties that it was also a very bit of this area that I call community development as a mode of cultural production was a very powerful and and just hearing talking about [01:11:00] a quilt made me remind me that in Auckland there was this 1990 Commonwealth quote that we she organised with a lot of in that case artists, but also quilting volunteers. And so there was a sort of power around community cultural, um, development as a cultural practise, not just individual, say, professional artists. And it had a lot of social currency, and it did fall away quite soon [01:11:30] after that. So it was sort of a The quilting was, um it's a, let's, say, an antique mode of production. But it actually had a lot of right at that moment which, you know, helped with the message because a lot of people were tuned into that sort of, you know, collaborative, community based practise the film An American how to make an American film film. But I can remember [01:12:00] all sorts of, um, sort of books about community cultural production Would actually have examples about AIDS books as examples of of, you know, contemporary, you know, socially relevant. Um, practise, you know. Right. Well, thank you everyone for coming. Um, this has been a really great talk. And and thank you, Julia, Kevin and Richard for, um no worries. And thank you, Gareth as well. And, um, Judy from the New Zealand AIDS Foundation. It will be available [01:12:30] for, um, informal conversation just over here. Um, and also also, Kevin has bought some historical documents as well. Um, just in the back corner. So thank you all again.
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