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Uh, well, my name is Ramon. I'm here for the out games. I was going to register as a participant. However, because I was travelling in the Outback of Australia without a phone or Internet connectivity, I wasn't able to complete the registration. Um, before I got back to Melbourne, So I thought, Well, since I've already got my flights and accommodation booked for Wellington, I'll just come over and volunteer my time. Is this the first kind of queer human rights conference you've been to? It is. Yes, It's the first one. And, uh, from the welcoming, [00:00:30] Um um, seminar this morning. Just judging from that, it looks like it's going to be a very interesting conference indeed. What do you expect or what do you want out of it? I had absolutely no expectations at all. Um, the only thing I would like to get out of it, I suppose, is, um, connecting with other people and discussing with them their, you know, adventures and journeys, I suppose, And hearing their stories. A few of the speakers this morning, for example, were very engaging. [00:01:00] Are you involved in the kind of queer community in Melbourne? Very little. No, not very much at all. I pretty much just work 9 to 5. Go home, maybe go out on the weekends sometimes, but not very often. And that's that's about the extent of it. But I do a lot of travel as well, not only for work, but for pleasure. And so, in terms of human rights in relation to, say, queer people in Australia, how are they at this point in time? Um, I'm not, [00:01:30] to be honest, entirely sure, Um, I know that it's still a long way to go with certain, um, issues, particularly around gay marriage, for example. And as someone mentioned this morning, a lot of people are setting are settling for an equivalent or, you know, something to to, um, appease us for the time being, as opposed to giving us the same thing that heterosexuals have. Um, those sorts of things I think need to be discussed more. Um, there are groups that [00:02:00] do that in Melbourne. Uh, there's at least one MP that I know of who is gay. And, um um, uh works quite hard towards achieving those sorts of goals, but, um, how things are overall in Australia or or you know, more locally in Melbourne. I wouldn't. Wouldn't be too sure. So how was it for you then? In terms of personally, have you, um, kind of had any discrimination in terms of your sexuality or gender? I would say none at all. I'm quite privileged. Um, no problems at all. Except, [00:02:30] uh, when I was much younger with family, a couple of members weren't so happy about that kind of news. But everybody else friends, school work. There have never been any problems in terms of things like school. Um, was when you were going through school, wasn't mentioned in, you know, in class. It was mentioned a little bit. Not very much in sex Ed, for example. Things like that would be touched upon but not really discussed in depth. And obviously, [00:03:00] Children being Children around that age, going through puberty, they would be gossiping about who they think is gay and things like that and making jokes and be a little bit of bullying, especially to people who were obviously gay, even though that could be wrong. But people that were perceived to be obviously gay would often be ridiculed or bullied. But overall, as far as the school curriculum was concerned. It was there a little bit, but not a lot. And so what about in workplaces now? Do you [00:03:30] feel comfortable or can you be out in your workplace? I think that I can, Yes, absolutely no problem at all. I can say that confidently. And are you out at work? In my previous job, I was, and that was no problem. And I would discuss what I got up to on the weekend with a couple of colleagues of mine. Or they might ask about who I was dating at the time. And, you know, I would ask him and her the same sorts of things so we would have an open conversation around those things, and it was never an issue. But [00:04:00] I realise how lucky that is. And not everyone has those privileges. In a previous job, when I was much younger, I used to work with a lesbian woman who was in her fifties, and she told me terrible stories of being bullied at work and losing jobs and things like that when they found out that she was a lesbian. So she said that you know, us whipper snappers, these days have got it quite quite easy compared to to back then because she used to march in the in the parades where there were riots and everything like that in the streets. Um, this [00:04:30] is going way back to the seventies, I would imagine. But she used to be a part of that. And she she was a part of the group of people that were first fighting and campaigning for equality and those rights and things. And now I guess my generation is living with the benefits. Are there any specific things that need to be fought for nowadays? Hm? In developed countries, um, it's becoming easier. Um, but in other nations, for example, around African [00:05:00] nations, definitely more more funding and campaigning things need to go on. Education of the public, I think, is the biggest way to do it. The easiest way. Well, you know the only way too many people still don't know what it means to be gay. They can't imagine it. So they because they can't see themselves in that position or doing what they think it is that we do. Then they turn against it and come up with their own ideas and and basically hate you for it. [00:05:30] So, um, in terms of things that need to be done still, obviously not becoming complacent still maintaining, um, equal rights and things like that, um, and achieving full equality, not not just for, you know, some mediocre step in between. You know, like, um, civil unions, It's not the same as a marriage. So we still need to work on things like that in your travels. Have you sensed there's a kind of a common theme through kind of queer culture, or is it quite different in each country that [00:06:00] you've been to in the countries that I've been to so far, the queer culture for want of a better expression has been pretty much the same. Actually, I've travelled around New Zealand, Australia and Europe, and my experience is that it's a very similar feeling. The only difference is, I think, in New Zealand, and also in Europe, gay marriage or the equivalent is legal and accepted, whereas in Australia it is not. [00:06:30] Which is quite disappointing. Are there any other similarities? Yeah, the similarities would be Well, my perception is that especially with young gay guys too much you know, party, party drinking, that sort of thing going on, um, you know, trying to to pick up and things like that. That's a common theme, I think, among young gay men, particularly in Europe, actually. Well, you see it everywhere. [00:07:00] It's common between Australia and and Germany, but I've seen it a lot worse. Or, you know, just more so in Europe than I have here. Well, that kind of brings up the whole kind of thing of kind of safe sex and kind of HIV and AIDS and stuff. And what are your experiences in Terms of, I mean, is safe sex practised in all those locations or most definitely, it's not, um, the younger generation is becoming, uh, ignorant or complacent about it. [00:07:30] Previously, I think in the eighties there was a scare campaign. I guess you could say, with the advertising on television, really driving home that message about AIDS, and you don't take the risk. You're gambling with your life, that sort of thing. But now that message is forgotten. It's falling on deaf ears. Obviously, if the party scene and the rave scene, drugs and alcohol play a part and lead to people taking risks that they might not normally take. And the [00:08:00] education, I guess, is lacking a little bit as well, and also with modern medical treatment. I guess many people are thinking, Oh, if I do get something, then there's treatment for that Life expectancy and so on with HIV AIDS is now greatly increased, so they may be not thinking that it will greatly impact their life. But regardless of what medical advances there are, it is still going to impact your life even socially. If you have to tell someone. Oh, by the way, I'm positive or what have [00:08:30] you? Um, then your relationship with that person is going to be changed. So it's not just the medical side of it as well. And a lot of people are not realising that. So did you have any kind of role models or kind of gay icons that you looked up to that that kind of gave you this kind of, uh, I mean, you seem to have quite a holistic view on things or a very balanced, stable view on things. Uh, I guess I'm asking, you know, where does that [00:09:00] come from? There's no particular role model that I have. Actually, I grew up in a very small town on the south coast of New South Wales and Australia, And, um, during school, Um, I didn't know anyone else that was gay. There were no role models in the public. Um, there wasn't much, you know, queer television, either. I mean, the only show I can recall back then would be, uh, will and Grace, for example. But that's not much to base your own life on, is it? Um, I guess where some of those ideas [00:09:30] and things come from that I have are from my own experiences and also from some of my older friends. For example, the lady I used to work with, who was a Lisbon and fought really hard and a friend of mine in Germany who is also in his forties or fifties. Now who's gone through some of the same things. Um, and he's also very, very vigilant when it comes to safe sex and things like that and tells, you know, everybody to be the same because, you know, it's not just one thing that you could get. It's a range of things and, um, yeah, [00:10:00] I've taken on board some of the lessons that he's taught as well like from his own experiences. If we were to look forward 30 years, um and somebody was listening back to this recording, what would you like to say to them? If anything, um, I would like to ask them. Have we achieved equality completely, 100%. And, um, is your life good? Well, finally, can I ask [00:10:30] those two questions to you? I mean one. Have Do you think you've achieved equality and two, Is your life good? No. And yes. Um, no. Equality is still not there yet. Um, I don't feel completely OK or safe about telling everybody I meet that I'm gay. In fact, there are some circumstances where it's better not to. Um and it's also not necessary. In a lot of, you know, cases. Like when I go to work, I'm there to work. I don't have to go and say hi. My name is Raman. I'm gay. How [00:11:00] are you? Like that's completely unnecessary. Um um And about my life. Am I happy? The answer is yes. I've got everything I need.
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